I have a 1970 nova mini tubbed ford 9 inch posi 4.11's 12.5 wide tires. 406 with lt1 angle plug heads. I want to do something more to the motor. IE blower, fuelie, aluminum heads something to make some more power. What do you think??
Thanks Eric
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I have a 1970 nova mini tubbed ford 9 inch posi 4.11's 12.5 wide tires. 406 with lt1 angle plug heads. I want to do something more to the motor. IE blower, fuelie, aluminum heads something to make some more power. What do you think??
Thanks Eric
N2o,is the cheapest way to add power.With a 400 block they are very prone to blown head gaskets,cracks,running hot etc.Put a 150 shot of n2o on it and call it good.Quote:
Originally posted by 1970Nova406
I have a 1970 nova mini tubbed ford 9 inch posi 4.11's 12.5 wide tires. 406 with lt1 angle plug heads. I want to do something more to the motor. IE blower, fuelie, aluminum heads something to make some more power. What do you think??
Thanks Eric
Im trying to stay away from no2 this car is a street and strip car just built never ran at the track yet. Tax time is coming and I like to buy something pretty big to go faster but I dont wanna hurt anything.
THanks Eric
Invest in a set of aluminum heads like the Brodix Race rite 180's or Dart 180 cc heads I would not go any larger and add a hyd. roller cam and lifters.
I was thinking heads but I'm not sure what to go with 202's or 205's? I was also thinking single carb. supercharger
THanks Again Eric
What 2.02's or 2.05's?This refers to the valve size and not the port size.I would not bother with a single carb blower because you will have to spin so fast to get any boost out of it if you are refering to a ( roots style blower).Quote:
Originally posted by 1970Nova406
I was thinking heads but I'm not sure what to go with 202's or 205's? I was also thinking single carb. supercharger
THanks Again Eric
valve's
While valve size is important the port size will have more of an effect on the engine.
what are lt1 angle plug heads?
The LT1 heads have a port volume of 170 cc on the intake side and 62 cc on the exhaust side.
how much money do you have to spend?
Thanks for the info on my heads!! I have $3500. and some change
THanks Eric
i'm wondering..what would be the pro's and cons of a centrigual blower through a carb with his set up? yeah.. a set of brodix heads would be a big improvement . but how would the super charger perform?that would definitly put more strain on your budget. also you have to have compression low enough to be able to run pump gas and still build boost?
With a good intake,carb,heads hyd. roller cam,and enough comp. ratio you should be able to do 500 to 525 h.p.One area we did not talk about was flow numbers.The general idea is to have good flow numbers with a small port volume.
I want a big enough diffrence that I can tell not just a little oh, but a big wow!!
thanks Eric
What are your cam specs. now?What is your stall speed?
Not sure on the cam but I would guess around a 500 lift I have a 2800 stall but getting around 2000
I would look at 3,500 stall to help launch the car.Yes it will build some heat so you would have to install a tranny cooler.If you are wanting to build a large amount of power I would not run a 400.I.M.O. around 550 h.p.the 400 blocks get more than a little un-stable.Yes, this will bother a few people that I said that.The early 350 block if preped right will handle around 575.
go to 200cc intake runner size heads for a 406. I would go with a set of 200cc dart pro 1's or Brodix race rite. 406 can use more cam too. Comp 280 magnum or bigger.
He say's he has around .500 lift.A 200cc runner is way to big.I would stay at 180 cc at the largest.Quote:
Originally posted by Skybu
go to 200cc intake runner size heads for a 406. I would go with a set of 200cc dart pro 1's or Brodix race rite. 406 can use more cam too. Comp 280 magnum or bigger.
I'd go with Brodix track 1s or afr 220,victor jr intake ,850 holley
and a cam with about 270 @.050 and .600" .
My combo a 3500lbs goes 10.98 @125 with no drivability problems other than the loose converter,but it is more of a weekend warrior,besides small heads just make too much lower
end to hook up on the street. There are quite a few heads that work good on your 406.
If you can't hook your car up you work with the chassis.You don't put on heads with a larger port volume.Are you kidding me??:whacked: :whacked: :LOL: :LOL:Quote:
Originally posted by raceparts
I'd go with Brodix track 1s or afr 220,victor jr intake ,850 holley
and a cam with about 270 @.050 and .600" .
My combo a 3500lbs goes 10.98 @125 with no drivability problems other than the loose converter,but it is more of a weekend warrior,besides small heads just make too much lower
end to hook up on the street. There are quite a few heads that work good on your 406
Everyone is entitled to their own preferences. It's up to You (the engine builder/owner) to decide what you want.
A relatively mild 406cid engine will more than handle the 200cc runners of a good flowing head. The small amount of torque loss given up at lower engine speeds will be made up by the convertor and cubic inches. If you want a performance 406, smaller heads (than 200cc) will choke it down after 5k RPM. You could go to AFR 190cc heads and it would be money well spent. Their ports are smaller but out flow the cheaper 200cc heads. If this is to be a performance engine and not a daily, sitting in traffic, commuting to work and grandma driving it to store engine. Build it with the fastest opening (aggressive) cam and MATCHED COMPONENTS of your preference. The more aggressive cam is easily recognized by the advertised duration compared to the .050 duration and lift. For example, a 280 advertised with 230 @ .050 and lift of .480 is less aggressive than a 280 advertised with 240 @ .050 and lift of .525. The more aggressive cams are harder on valve train components but do make more hp and torque. You have to use more spring pressure to control them and spring pressure wears out parts such as guides, tappets, and rocker arms much quicker. There are some good hydraulic roller cams that are much easier on parts. For a naturally aspirated engine, you would need the LSA (lobe separation angle) on about a 104*. That also kills street drivabilty and vacuum to operate brakes and such, although not to the point where it not drivable. You'll just have a lumpy idle and low vacuum.
On another note, the Weiand 177 super charger kit with a blower cam is very streetable as long as you have no more than 9.0:1 CR ratio and a BTM with timing retard. You wouldn't have to go near as much cam, have plenty vacuum, and performance will be outstanding. The 406 will handle it fine with MLS gaskets and 4-5 lbs boost max. The blower will make full boost around 2200-2500 RPM with WOT. With the blower setup, a good blower cam and free flowing exhaust is important. You don't need high lift although a little bit more spring pressure than standard is required. For more info, go to Holley's website and look up the instructions for part no. 6512-1 and read it. It explains the way the charger works and what is needed for dependable service.
There are a lot of ways to build HP but it always comes at a price. The more HP you build, the less dependable it becomes. A mild 406 can deliver good performance and reliability if built to do so. But if you're wanting more than what you got now, you must be prepared to give up how long it will last.
He states he has around .500 lift and he is getting 2,000 for a stall speed.If he runs a head with 200 cc port volume he will have no low speed throttle responce.It takes torque to get a car moving.Quote:
Originally posted by camaro_fever68
Everyone is entitled to their own preferences. It's up to You (the engine builder/owner) to decide what you want.
A relatively mild 406cid engine will more than handle the 200cc runners of a good flowing head. The small amount of torque loss given up at lower engine speeds will be made up by the convertor and cubic inches. If you want a performance 406, smaller heads (than 200cc) will choke it down after 5k RPM. You could go to AFR 190cc heads and it would be money well spent. Their ports are smaller but out flow the cheaper 200cc heads. If this is to be a performance engine and not a daily, sitting in traffic, commuting to work and grandma driving it to store engine. Build it with the fastest opening (aggressive) cam and MATCHED COMPONENTS of your preference. The more aggressive cam is easily recognized by the advertised duration compared to the .050 duration and lift. For example, a 280 advertised with 230 @ .050 and lift of .480 is less aggressive than a 280 advertised with 240 @ .050 and lift of .525. The more aggressive cams are harder on valve train components but do make more hp and torque. You have to use more spring pressure to control them and spring pressure wears out parts such as guides, tappets, and rocker arms much quicker. There are some good hydraulic roller cams that are much easier on parts. For a naturally aspirated engine, you would need the LSA (lobe separation angle) on about a 104*. That also kills street drivabilty and vacuum to operate brakes and such, although not to the point where it not drivable. You'll just have a lumpy idle and low vacuum.
On another note, the Weiand 177 super charger kit with a blower cam is very streetable as long as you have no more than 9.0:1 CR ratio and a BTM with timing retard. You wouldn't have to go near as much cam, have plenty vacuum, and performance will be outstanding. The 406 will handle it fine with MLS gaskets and 4-5 lbs boost max. The blower will make full boost around 2200-2500 RPM with WOT. With the blower setup, a good blower cam and free flowing exhaust is important. You don't need high lift although a little bit more spring pressure than standard is required. For more info, go to Holley's website and look up the instructions for part no. 6512-1 and read it. It explains the way the charger works and what is needed for dependable service.
There are a lot of ways to build HP but it always comes at a price. The more HP you build, the less dependable it becomes. A mild 406 can deliver good performance and reliability if built to do so. But if you're wanting more than what you got now, you must be prepared to give up how long it will last.
He also states he wants more. Less than 200cc want get it.Quote:
Originally posted by erik erikson
He states he has around .500 lift and he is getting 2,000 for a stall speed.If he runs a head with 200 cc port volume he will have no low speed throttle responce.It takes torque to get a car moving.
WHAT??Quote:
Originally posted by camaro_fever68
He also states he wants more. Less than 200cc want get it.
It sounds to me like he wants to build a hot engine. 200cc heads will be a must have. As long as he takes into account the problems that associate a hot engine, he can build what he wants to build. I run 215cc heads on a 10:1 383 with a stall speed of 2500 and 4.11 gears on a 30" tire. I pull both front wheels at the track on MT street ET's. I only turn my engine 6200 and I make plenty torque.Quote:
Originally posted by erik erikson
WHAT??
Next you are going to tell me it turn's 10.20's.Way to much head.The car would run quicker if it had smaller heads on it.Quote:
Originally posted by camaro_fever68
It sounds to me like he wants to build a hot engine. 200cc heads will be a must have. As long as he takes into account the problems that associate a hot engine, he can build what he wants to build. I run 215cc heads on a 10:1 383 with a stall speed of 2500 and 4.11 gears on a 30" tire. I pull both front wheels at the track on MT street ET's. I only turn my engine 6200 and I make plenty torque.
Don't be a dick, I know what I got, I know what I build, and I know how they run.Quote:
Originally posted by erik erikson
Next you are going to tell me it turn's 10.20's.Way to much head.The would run quicker if it had smaller heads on it.
Why do you go against dart and all other cylinder head manufactures on their recommendations?
Dart cleary states in their SBC Reference Guide:
180cc---Street Performance, maximum throttle response and torque; 327/350
200cc---Street Performance & and restricted oval track; 327/350
215cc---Serious Street Performance, Oval Track, Bracket Racing; 7000 RPM 383/400
So are you calling me a liar or what. My 383 runs low 11's.
Wow, name calling now.You state you only turn your engine to 6,200 I really don't think you should call that "Serious street.Low 11's is that in the 1/8 mile?Quote:
Originally posted by camaro_fever68
Don't be a dick, I know what I got, I know what I build, and I know how they run.
Why do you go against dart and all other cylinder head manufactures on their recommendations?
Dart cleary states in their SBC Reference Guide:
180cc---Street Performance, maximum throttle response and torque; 327/350
200cc---Street Performance & and restricted oval track; 327/350
215cc---Serious Street Performance, Oval Track, Bracket Racing; 7000 RPM 383/400
So are you calling me a liar or what. My 383 runs low 11's.
I don't know what your problem is and frankly don't care. I don't have a time slip handy, but it is 11's in the quarter. My 60ft isn't where I would like it but that is due to the tight convertor. I run a Comp solid roller part no. 12-900-9 with a Victor Jr. and a 750dp. I call it hot street, and not much hangs with it on the street.Quote:
Originally posted by erik erikson
Wow, name calling now.You state you only turn your engine to 6,200 I really don't think you should call that "Serious street.Low 11's is that in the 1/8 mile?
I don't really have a problem.I just don't like to be called names.In the future see if you can articulate yourself in a different manner.Quote:
Originally posted by camaro_fever68
I don't know what your problem is and frankly don't care. I don't have a time slip handy, but it is 11's in the quarter. My 60ft isn't where I would like it but that is due to the tight convertor. I run a Comp solid roller part no. 12-900-9 with a Victor Jr. and a 750dp. I call it hot street, and not much hangs with it on the street.
Try to articulate yourself as to not come off as one. I don't like the way you argue everyone else's point. Like I said, I know what I built, and I know how it runs. Makes it hard to see your point of going to a really much smaller head. I can't see a 180cc head doing anything for me but slowing me down. If anything, I'm running out of steam on the topend and that's not head related.Quote:
Originally posted by erik erikson
I don't really have a problem.I just don't like to be called names.In the future see if you can articulate yourself in a different manner.
With your low stall speed the smaller heads would help you get out of the hole better.Quote:
Originally posted by camaro_fever68
Try to articulate yourself as to not come off as one. I don't like the way you argue everyone else's point. Like I said, I know what I built, and I know how it runs. Makes it hard to see your point of going to a really much smaller head. I can't see a 180cc head doing anything for me but slowing me down. If anything, I'm running out of steam on the topend and that's not head related.
I can see going to 200cc as I am anyway. But I seriously doubt 180cc would benefit me past the 60ft mark. A stock 350 has 170cc on the vortec engines. A healthy 383 or a mild 406 would handle a 200cc like it came stock on there. The only reason I am pulling the 215's is I need them on another stroker 400 build up. Your theory on head size will soon be seen.Quote:
Originally posted by erik erikson
With your low stall speed the smaller heads would help you get out of the hole better.
WHat I had said about big heads was not so you can hook up its to move the power band up and take torque away on a limited
tire street car. If you street race down here you need to have your game on. At the track any car will hook on the street it's more of a science,Ive seen 12 second cars Slamm 10 second cars
on quite a few street races
I could do a set of Track 1s or AFRs that would give you about 100hp over what you got for $2500.00 something thatwill flow about a true 300cfm @.650 would be plenty.
i like the 200 cc head and the supercharger ideas...but thats my opinion.
When u talk about putting that tight head on there u also talk about upping compression which ups the amount of octane needed to make it run right. If he's gonna run it on the street at all he probably doesn't want to have to run 5 dollar a gallon (at least that's what it is here) race gas... Yes, race gas at octane levels over 110 is nice (as is alcohol) but you wouldn't want that on the street. It's not always about power and hooking up.
Yes you could get that stuff rolling with your tax money but could you afford 5 dollars a gallon (which would last u 1 race on the street) ?? JMO. If it were mine and i had 3500 dollars in cash money, I'd just find me a *good* lower compression head and slap a supercharger on it.
Oh how true ! I have seen this put into action many times in my years of street racing.Quote:
Originally posted by raceparts
WHat I had said about big heads was not so you can hook up its to move the power band up and take torque away on a limited
tire street car. If you street race down here you need to have your game on. At the track any car will hook on the street it's more of a science,Ive seen 12 second cars Slamm 10 second cars
on quite a few street races
200cc head is the minimum on a HOT 406 small block.
I think I understand why everyone is saying run the 200 cc heads.When I buy a set of heads I order them bare.At the vary least I will do a bowl blend, some work around the valve guide area, a gasket match blended at least 1 inch into the port.The whole idea is to have a smaller port volume with higher flow numbers.Most of the time when I do the port work on the 180 cc head they end up in the 185 to 188 area.