Engine gurus - Need your input...

All,

My 350 gave up on me in my '68 Camaro a few weeks back. I went to look at a local "for sale" motor today, and am weighing this purchase against buying a crate ZZ4 (or HO 350) or having a shop redo my 2BM. The local motor was very clean, looked great, and had the following:

11.5:1 compressions, flat-top pistons, type unknown
1010 crank (I don't know what that means)
camel-back heads from a '66 motor
77 350 block bored .30 over - 4BM
Crane roller rocker arms and Crane rods - I pulled the valve cover & intake to verify
Unknown type of polished intake with a Holley 600
Unknown type of chrome water pump

The seller states that it will run well on 93 octane, but the 11.5:1 is concerning to me. Also, I don't know what these type of heads allow. My '68 is a street cruiser, but I wouldn't pass up any extra "streetable" HP or tQ.

Any comments and/or suggestions are welcome. I know there is plenty of talent here to help me out.

Thanks...Hobo

Is it for sale by someone you know, or a stranger. If I wasn't sure about the mechanical abilities of the builder I would go for the crate motor that comes with a warranty......

I'm not an engine guru, but I'd steer clear of any street engine with 11.5 to 1 compression ratio. By the way, "1010" crank means that the main and rod journals was been ground .010" undersize. Buy the crate motor.

Bob

Dave,
I don't know this guy, or the builder he acquired it from. The sale price is $2500, which is just about what the GM 350 HO runs without the bolt-ons...

Hobo

honestly, for 2500 dollars you could build a pretty ground thunderin motor on your own stand with parts of your disgretion. This way, you know the work is good because you did it yourself, you know exactly what went into the motor, all the parts would be brand new, and then you could custom taylor the motor to your needs.

On the options that you said, however, I wouldn't buy that motor unless you could get the shop to commit to a build sheet telling you exactly what is in that motor...Those "11.5:1" pistons could be cast pieces of junk and you'd never even know it until your down $2500 and the shop won't have anything to do with you.

Not even a choice then, go with the crate engine and the warranty. Last machine shop and balance bill I had was about $600. Add to that all the good parts and a brand new set of heads....You're a ways over $2500 allready. I always figure my time, even building my own motor, is worth something. If I can drop in a crate motor that does everything I need it to do I do it!!! My NAPA guy gets me reman stocker motors for about $1200.00 exchange, less for a chebbie, and they come with a 36 month 36,000 mile warranty.

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Originally Posted by Dave Severson

Not even a choice then, go with the crate engine and the warranty. Last machine shop and balance bill I had was about $600. Add to that all the good parts and a brand new set of heads....You're a ways over $2500 allready. I always figure my time, even building my own motor, is worth something. If I can drop in a crate motor that does everything I need it to do I do it!!! My NAPA guy gets me reman stocker motors for about $1200.00 exchange, less for a chebbie, and they come with a 36 month 36,000 mile warranty.

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i wish i could trust my napa guys but since i live in san diego, they're all shipped out of mexico with the cheapest parts available on the automotive market.... but seeing that i work in a shop.... i can build my motors myself.... its just a matter of fitting the time in to do it.... ussually if i'm at work working on a motor, i want to get paid to do it....

but yeah i'd stick with a GM crate motor, they're good reliable motors, i've heard a few complaints of oil pan gaskets leaking..... but they're few and far apart..... and you really should check all that stuff anyways.... ya never know what happened during the shipping process

I have a similarly built 350 with crane cam, springs and lifters, double hump 2.02 fuelie heads and a 10.5:1 CR, a 600 carb on a Torker 1 intake, pushing out 350 hp and while streetable, not an every day driver. You would be better off going with a new crate motor. You can get a 350/260 hp for under $1400 and then build it to your own liking. That, plus a 12 month 12000mile warranty for putting it in a GM vehicle would seal the deal. You might qualify for longer warranty since you are replacing an original 350.

The crate engine will have 8.5 compresson out of the box and run 87 octane, mine requires premium 93/94 and at today's prices, it's not as much fun.:CRY:

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Originally Posted by mopar34

The crate engine will have 8.5 compresson out of the box and run 87 octane, mine requires premium 93/94 and at today's prices, it's not as much fun.:CRY:

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93/94????? we can only get 91 here in california..... the only way i can get the proper fuel for my mustang is buying trick which is expensive..... luckily its not my daily driver anymore

"93/94????? we can only get 91 here in california..... the only way i can get the proper fuel for my mustang is buying trick which is expensive..... luckily its not my daily driver anymore"

Another good reason not to live in California :LOL:

Here in sunny, but chilly, south central PA, we have Sunoco gas which comes in both the 93 and 94 octane varieties. Both of my cars drink the stuff, and I should probably say "guzzle the stuff", since one gets 6 mpg and the other gets 10 mpg in local traffic. The 94 blend is only 1 octane point above the other, but it seems to make a big difference in starting and running. That one little octane point will set you back and additional 20+ cents per gallon over the 93. Last time I filled up the 94 was $3.39 and the 93 was $3.16. Regualr was $2.86. :CRY: :CRY:

I am also pleased that neither are daily drivers.:D

last time i filled up my mustang on the 104 trick i paid $8.29 a gallon at the pump :CRY:


2.86 for regular?!!!!!!!?!!!!! thats cheap... well in an overpriced gas market that is..... i paid $3.35 for regular(87) today and that was at the cheapest gas station in town

Check out the yearone website. They offer a new 350 bored .30 over, 4bolt mains that has alot of goodies for a super $2990.00. Just need the dist, water pump, wires etc. You could probably use the ones of your motor for now and replace as you go. Pushes 400 hp, more than 450ft pds torque and is balanced, blueprinted, AND they send you the dyno sheets W/ a one year warranty to boot. Seems like a great deal...Good luck.

If you want to wake up that Camaro, buy a GM 383 crate engine or the 383 shortblock if you want to finish the top of the engine yourself. It is easy to get over 400 very streetable horsepower with a 383. And they make gobs of torque.

Hobo,
I agree with a crate engine. There are alot of sources out there. The 383 from chev. is sweet because it is a re-design not a stroked 350 and can use the roller cam and has the one-piece rear seal. You can get the short block and add heads etc. Yours might be useable depending on valve size and cc's. If you go this way and use roller cam "don't forget" to use roller cam dist. gear or you will destroy cam. There is another crate motor that every one forgets and this is the 1991-93 Chevrolet, Cadillac B & D (L05)(5.7K) for $2,067.71 from Pace Chev. This has roller cam, 1-piece seal late heads and 9.6 to 1 comp. Check out link for info
http://www.paceparts.com/index.asp?P...D&ProdID=42937
IMHO this is an unsung great crate from chev. and I have seen them under $2000. Good luck,
Jim

I bought my ZZ502/550 crate engine from

http://www.sallee-chevrolet.com/index.html

I recommend them highly. They can adjust anything you buy any way you want. It cost $210 to ship it from Oregon to Texas ..........

Kitz

Thanks everyone for all the replies. I went to purchase a ZZ4, but some financial issues came around (anyone else have those?), and I ended up buying the 290-horse crate motor. Does anyone have a recommendation for a cam swap that would wake it up more, or should I just leave it alone and drive it? I'm thinking of putting my Weiand X-cellerator or Edel. Performer intake and my Holley 650 on it which may help a little as well. Other than that, just some engine paint and chrome dress-up items (more for me to clean).

Thanks again...

Hobo

Call CompCams Cam Help line and have them make a recommendation. 800-999-0853. Have all of your car's stats ready. I am sure they are familiar with that crate engine. You should be able to pump that up to 330-350 hp with a different cam and kit.

Thanks Rum! I saw your other post as well. I was trying not to double-post, but didn't know if anyone would read the older one...

Hobo

If your budget is tight, you might just install the crate as it is. Then, if you really need more power, start with the upgrades.

I put the exact same crate in my 69 Camaro recently. I was considering putting in a roller cam and rockers before I dropped it in, but some other unexpected expenditures came up. Sometimes, I wish there was more power, but I bet I would be saying the same thing even if I could have afforded the 502 Ramjet. With gas prices as they are, I'm glad I didn't put in the higher performance parts.