yep there ok used them many years ago . Competition products or flatlanders . do very good and better on some parts as Competiton products owns Howards cam or at least in the same shop .i still use them on some parts. they are very hard to beat on the price of some stuff .i am a dealer for EPW/PBM Erson cam. Engine pro.The perfit corp .many others and they all do very good. find a dealer near you. your machine shop should be set up to sell to you ? i shop around alot for the best deal for my customers .some times Ebays not bad find some one cleaning out a shop for left overs. check the guys feed back before you buy