Thread: 53 Is back from the Body Shop

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one last bunch of pics

JMHO, when I'm pulling a trailer I don't use overdrive except on straight flats.

Loved the pictures! Made me smile and I needed it. Thanks

Hope things are good by you, there's quite a smoke haze over the Black Hills due to the California fires. I guess I never thought much about pulling in OD, I figured it will shift down if it needs to. Maybe that's not the right way to think. I''m going to put on a remote cooler with a thermostat and fan.

Smoke has been heavy, blocked the sun out one day very eerie and very unhealthy. Today was a good day though.

Cooler will fix you up, but I'd still watch the overdrive when pulling.

I got a brake question for you guys. I cannot get Rita's back brakes to grab as much as they should, It's really noticeable when pulling a trailer that it is almost entirely reliant on the front brakes. The master cylinder is an 1/16 bore off of a 1990 F-150 , The rears are disc brakes off of a 2000 Explorer, The fronts are GM metrics that came with the m2 kit, not really sure exactly what the vehicle they're off of. I have a willwood adjustable proportioning valve, and with max pressure to the rear brakes, I still can't get them to slide on a gravel road, and smashed hard to the floor, you can power brake like there's almost no brakes there. I've double and triple checked the line routing to the proportioning valve, and swapped the front and rear lines around on the valve, absolutely nothing I do makes a noticeable difference. The only thing I'm starting to think is that I maybe need a smaller bore master cylinder to increase caliper pressure, a 2000 Explorer with four wheel disc brakes does use a 1 in master cylinder vs my 1/16. Any suggestions?

Originally Posted by 53 Chevy5

I got a brake question for you guys. I cannot get Rita's back brakes to grab as much as they should, It's really noticeable when pulling a trailer that it is almost entirely reliant on the front brakes. The master cylinder is an 1/16 bore off of a 1990 F-150 , The rears are disc brakes off of a 2000 Explorer, The fronts are GM metrics that came with the m2 kit, not really sure exactly what the vehicle they're off of. I have a willwood adjustable proportioning valve, and with max pressure to the rear brakes, I still can't get them to slide on a gravel road, and smashed hard to the floor, you can power brake like there's almost no brakes there. I've double and triple checked the line routing to the proportioning valve, and swapped the front and rear lines around on the valve, absolutely nothing I do makes a noticeable difference. The only thing I'm starting to think is that I maybe need a smaller bore master cylinder to increase caliper pressure, a 2000 Explorer with four wheel disc brakes does use a 1 in master cylinder vs my 1/16. Any suggestions?

After reading your description my first thought is that you are not using a master cylinder for Disc / Disc front & rear. To me it sounds like you are not getting enough fluid into the rear. Or maybe the master you are using doesn't have the capacity needed for your rear brakes. My other thought is that perhaps the calipers have pushed all the fluid back into the master, then when you hit the pedal there isn't enough volume from the master to build psi.....

Not sure on your brakes but those are some awesome pictures!

On the OD, when I took ol' gray, '90 F150 to haul the coupe home we were pulling the empty trailer and the tranny started shifting funny. A quick check of the truck manual said to never use OD when towing. We left it in "D" after that and it was fine.

My 2017 F150 has the Max Tow package (10 speed), and it's got 3 modes - Economy, Sport and Tow/Haul. The Tow/Haul mode restricts the higher OD gears.

We have a 13 2500 Silverado at work and I have a 16 ram 1500 at home. With both of them, if you push the tow/ haul button They just downshift quicker going up hills and down shift sooner when you're stopping but they both still use overdrive. The Silverado just has the four speed automatic, my Dodge has a six-speed automatic. I'm just about certain the lock up failed in my torque converter and that's what caused all the problems, not the overdrive clutch. The ECM fault says transmission component slippage, my BIL will have a better scanner for what actually happened. The fluid does not smell burnt at all, so I guess that's maybe a good sign.

It's handy to have a BIL who has a tranny shop! Definitely good the fluid isn't burned.

I mis-spoke on my newer truck. Tow/haul delays upshifts to reduce frequency of transmission shifting. Tow/haul also provides engine braking in all forward gears when the transmission is in the D (Overdrive) position; this engine braking will slow the vehicle and assist the driver in controlling the vehicle when descending a grade. Depending on driving conditions and load conditions, the transmission may downshift, slow the vehicle and control the vehicle speed when descending a hill, without the accelerator pedal being pressed. The amount of downshift braking provided will vary based upon the amount the brake pedal is pressed.

The problem is he's the one who rebuilt the transmission only 10,000 miles ago ���� As a mechanic I know freak things can happen.

I'm starting to wonder if that's the case. I did some more research, a 2000 Ford Explorer also uses a 1 1 /16 bore master cylinder (not a 1-in bore like I thought), which would be the master cylinder that was used with rear end and brakes I'm using. A 1990 F-150 also uses a 1 1/16 master cylinder, but it of course has drum brakes in the rear which don't need as much fluid. I wonder if the Explorer master cylinder has a longer stroke so it is able to fill the rear calipers. I might grab an Explorer master cylinder from our local salvage yard and see if that fixes it.

There is a brake line valve called a hold off valve. It goes in the line to the front brakes and prevents them from operating until the line pressure reaches 100 psi or so. It is intended to allow rear drum brakes to catch up with front discs, since the drums have farther to move. Most distribution blocks for disc/drums have one built in.

I had an issue on my T bucket with the rear brakes not doing much, but they were drums front and rear. I installed stand alone hold off valve and it seemed to help. I know you have discs front and rear, but it sounds like you are having a similar problem. It may be worth a try if nothing else works.

It could also be a pad material issue. The brakes may actually be working as far as hydraulics, but the pads in the rear are harder and never getting up to operating temp.

I remember reading that on the S10 rears, GM was having an issue with rear brake lock up. This was in the days before anti-lock. Their solution was to use metallic shoes and very small wheel cylinders. This effectively prevented the rear brakes from doing much until the line pressure was very high and there was a lot of heat in them, like when hauling or towing heavy loads. This came from another forum, supposedly from a brake engineer familiar with the story. I do know that the S10 rear wheel cylinders were only 3/4" bore! Ford may have done a similar trick with the Explorer rear brakes. FWIW - I have Explorer rear brakes on my 46 and have never been completely satisfied with them either, but they worked well enough that I never got around to working out the reason why.

Going to a softer, higher friction pad material, may solve your problem. Seems like I remember that you are using an Explorer rear. I'm sure someone like EBC probably makes replacement pads in various known compounds. Going to something like EBC Yellow Stuff pads front and rear may make a difference. You could also look for full organic rear pads from the local parts store if they are available. Look at their cheapest line of parts. They should be softer and have a higher friction.

This is a typical hot rod issue. We take parts from different manufactures or different vehicles by the same manufacturer and hope that they will play nice together. Sometimes they don't. That's when you just have to give it some thought and start making changes.

Also, the Expedition calipers will fit on the Explorer brackets or at least they look like they should. They have a larger piston than the Explorer calipers. This would increase the clamping force a little. I have never made the swap, but plan to in the future on my 46 coupe. I suggested this to 40FordDeluxe and I think he either did it or at least tried it. He should have the details.

Thanks Mike, I did not know they made something like that, that could be exactly what I need! Tonight I'm going to eliminate the proportioning valve to see how it acts and see what my next step is from there.