You're right about the long welds! I had a pretty stiff back and neck from staying bent over in one spot for so long. Guess I'm not as limber as I used to be!:rolleyes: :LOL:
Mike
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You're right about the long welds! I had a pretty stiff back and neck from staying bent over in one spot for so long. Guess I'm not as limber as I used to be!:rolleyes: :LOL:
Mike
Not very much to report this week. I have a lot of small stuff to take care of and most of it just isn't "newsworthy". The biggest project I worked on was the cover for the bed.
It's made of 3/4" plywood and banded in solid wood. I wanted to round the edges over and plywood just doesn't work very well for that. In the picture, I haven't sanded or rounded the corners yet.
The gas filler is a sealed(no vent) aluminum marine unit and the hinges are chromed brass, also marine items. The LED third brake light is off of a Mitsubishi pickup. Sorry, I don't know the year.
This brings up a point about "traditional styling" and safety. I'll be the first to admit that I don't like the looks of third brake lights, but I also try to be practical. Our hot rodding forefathers didn't have to share the road with today's crop of hyper-distracted drivers. They lived in a time when you could get by with hand signals. Try that for very long today and you'll probably loose an arm!:CRY: Also, the current generation of drivers grew up looking at these cyclops eyes and have come to expect them. Nope, I don't like 'em, but I guess they're a good idea in the 21st century.:rolleyes:
I still don't know how I'm going to finish the cover. I'm kicking around covering it in fiberglass and painting it to match the body instead of having it upholstered. I also need to pick up and install a latch.
Nice work! And that is a nice unobtrusive place to put the 3rd brake light.:)
I agree with you; I would rather not have to have them, but I want people behind me to notice if I'm stopping.:HMMM: My coupe has a 3rd brakelight in the rear window. I don't know where I'll put one on the roadster, but it will have one somewhere...:rolleyes:
Nice how those marine items fit our builds, huh Mike? :) When I worked in the business I would dig around on the shelves and find lots of stuff that would cross over to a hot rod...........and the parts are corrosion resistant too.
I really like your bed cover. and that is a perfect place for the 3rd brake light. Tradition is one thing but safety is another thing. You are being smart. If we truly want to drive our cars we have to make some concessions. I have no problems using modern stuff like alternators and electric fans on otherwise old timey looking cars. I want to use my car and not have problems.
With some of the inattentive drivers today gabbing away on their cell phones you need all the help you can get.
Don
Thanks guys.
About the marine stuff working good on hot rods. I think the old Stewart Warner instrument panels and streamlined windshield frames like the Duval were carryovers too.
Mike
I knew early on I would want a third brake light and I had resigned myself to putting something in the back window or mounted on the trunk. But when I was looking at some pictures of a stock 37 LaSalle I noticed the sergeant bars on the back and that gave me an idea. It reminded me of the taillights on a 40 ford. So thanks to ebay I was able to find a good cheap 40 ford tailight and I will eventually fench it or modify it somehow to fit where the original stainless steel trim went.
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Attachment 27853
37 Caddy
Great idea! Should look nice frenched in.
Mike
That IS a good idea. :) :) Living here in Florida, with lots of little old lady drivers who can't see over the steering wheel, and lots of teen agers using cell phones, I should have put a 3rd light on too.
Don
Another one of those small projects is the lower radiator hose. The rad sits pretty close to the engine. So close in fact, that the fan bolts directly to the water pump with no spacer. The radiator is a Speedway item(from Ron Davis) for their 4 1/2" chopped 32 shell and the lower connection is angled out slightly toward the frame for some reason. Must be something specific to their 32 Low Boy kit.:HMMM: All this meant that the lower hose was going to have some strange tight bends. I decided to make one up out of steel tubing.
The tubing is just a 1 3/4" "J" bend. I turned a couple of oversize ends to keep the hose from slipping off under pressure.
I saw this happen on a video of a dyno run and it looked pretty hairy since hot water and steam went everywhere.:eek: I would hate to have that happen going down the road or worse yet, while I was standing over it.:CRY:
It's a pretty tight fit, but came out OK.:)
I also finally got around to finalizing the shock lever setup. There are several things I did when I started this project that I'm just not satisfied with and the pivots for the shock levers is one of them. I'm planning on clearing these little things up in the next few weeks.
The original pivot was just a short bronze bushing that turned on a 1/2" bolt. I had to add the teflon washers to stabilize the levers, otherwise the levers would just move sideways instead of up and down. The short bushing just wasn't enough. This just made the setup a friction shock with a hydraulic shock added to the top. I also knew the little bushing wasn't going to last very long even with regular greasing.
I have to admit that I sketched out some pretty elaborate "solutions":HMMM: for this problem. That's easy to do when you're just working on paper! In the end, I kept to the "KISS" principle:rolleyes: and used poly end link bushings. They are readily available and need little lubrication. I converted a couple of 3/4" bolts to shoulder bolts to use as "axles". These are welded to the levers. It all works good now and should give good service without much maintenance.
Here are the pieces that made up the original setup. This rig was going to cause problems. Keeping everything tight and lubricated was going to take a lot of maintenance.:(
Here are the new pieces. The sleeve is welded in the frame and the shoulder bolt is welded to the lever.
This is the setup I used to cut the holes in the frame for the sleeve. It's a simple setup, but it does help when you have to do it by hand. The hole in the wood block is done in the drill press, so it's square.
I finally got around to mounting the headlights. I had to wait on finalizing the shock and radiator mounting before I could get the lights done.
The headlights are from The Hot Rod Company. They are repros of the old Guide 682's. I have never seen a pair of the originals in person, so I can't comment on how authentic they are. They are very close to the pictures I've seen, but have been modernized with LED signals.:)
The lights come with mounting cups for a flat surface, but I didn't use them. Instead, I made some mounts out of 1 1/2" pipe. A 60 degree bevel on the inside made a solid cup for the light. I welded a plate inside for the bolt and fabbed covers for the bottom.
It's pretty tight around the shocks and that limited what kind of bracket I could use. After making some cardboard patterns, I cut the brackets out of 3/8" plate. They wound up being kind of convoluted to get around they shocks. I may add a couple of small gussets just to be on the safe side, but they are pretty solid now.
I had hoped to get the lights a little lower, but they had to be high enough to clear the drag link at full suspension compression. I have clearance for 3" of up travel at the wheel and that should be more than enough.
Thought I would take time for a few quick updates.
I've been working at redoing some of the original parts of the car that I don't like. When I started this project, my intentions were to build everything I could out of material I either had on hand or could get locally without special order. Lately, I started to rethink some of my early desicions from a safety standpoint. I felt that some of those early parts were just too light to be durable. The main items were the batwings and the front and rear four-bars.
The batwings were originally made from 1/8" plate that I had on hand. I remade them with 3/16" plate. The tapered perch bolt bushings and the C shaped pieces they mount to are from The Welder Series. I made these pieces on the originals, but the ready made parts were cheap enough that I couldn't justify the time to make them myself. You can see that the new batwings are quite a bit heavier that the old parts.
I also replaced the four-bar links front and rear with 4130 chromoly pieces. Not much external change on the front, but the new pieces are .188 wall thickness as opposed to .156 for the old stuff. The orginals were made from mild steel. The front bars are over 40" long with the adjusters and had a lot of flex. The new parts are lot stiffer without changing the look.
The rear bars went from 7/8" OD to 1 1/4" OD. I also went from 5/8" ends to 3/4". I don't think flex will be an issue anymore!:D In the pic, I left the old bar on top for comparison.
I built a bracket for the fuel pump and filter, too.
My first thought was to plumb the two together with a solid pipe nipple, but that would have made changing the pump difficult. The whole bracket will drop out with 2 bolts so service or modifications will be easier in the future. I plan on blowing the chassis apart soon to finish some welding and I'll mount all this then.
Next on the agenda was the pitman arm.
The original pitman arm was 3/8". The new one is 5/8". The box is a Vega unit laid on it's side. The pitman arm is setup like some cowl steering units I've seen. The big end of the original Vega pitman arm was converted into a sleeve and that was welded to a 3" diameter flange. The new arm and the flange will be bolted together. I also shortened the arm about 3/4" to get the four-bars and the draglink on the same angle.
Due to the spindle steering arm being ahead of the four-bar pivot, the draglink and the front bars are almost the same length. This should keep bump-steer to a minimum.
I'm not finished with this, but here are some pics of my progress so far.
One last comment.
My "to do" list is getting pretty short! I'm actually beginning to see the end of the fab work. As of the end of February, I've been on this project for 18 months, but it sure doesn't seem like that long. I'm hoping that I can start finishing for paint sometime in April and I plan to paint it myself. It'll be my first complete paint job. Hope I don't mess it up! First I have to get it inspected and stamped by the state troopers and I have no clue how long that will take. The last time I had to deal with anything like this it took two trips to Baton Rouge to get it all done.
The "war chest" is getting pretty empty, but if I don't go crazy with the spending or have any bad luck, I should have enough cash to finish. My wife just rolls her eyes and sighs when she pays the bills. That's usually followed by "More parts?"
"Yep, more parts, but I'm almost done,Honey, I swear!" Of course I still have an engine and trans to build. :rolleyes:
There is a local show in May and I would love to have it done by then, but we'll just have to see how it works out. I still haven't found anyone locally to do the upholstery, so that could be a real holdup, but if I get that close, I'll throw a mexican blanket and some foam in it and ride!!!
But if I don't have any unforseen problems, I should be rolling by summer and I sure am looking forward to it!!
BTW Ever since I replied to Oldrodder about having my projects sometimes turn out like Wile E Coyote's road runner traps, my family and I have been calling this thing the Coyote Special. So I guess it has a proper project name now. First car I've ever had with a name. Of course the Well's Coyotes were pretty well known for the Pike's Peak Hill Climb(driven by the likes of the Unser clan). Maybe one day this one will get there too. Now that's a real daydream! Louisiana to Pike's Peak........IN A T ROADSTER!!! Who knows, maybe I'm just crazy enough to try it one day.
Mike
I think you were very wise to go back and change the suspension pieces you did instead of waiting til they break!!! Moly is sooooo much stronger! I use moly for most all my suspension pieces and bracketry and though I too tend to sometimes build things a tad light, haven't had any failures yet....
BTW, that is some very nice metal finishing and welding on the car, very good work!
Dave
Thanks
Most of my past fab experience was in the oil field industry and I had a real tendency to build everything like it was going to be dragged around by a D8 Caterpillar!:eek:
I've been trying to "lighten up" a little in recent years, but I just got a little carried away on some of these pieces. Weight just isn't going to be a real issue on this car(unlike a race car) and I finally came to the conclusion that I just went too far this time.
Yeah, I know what you mean. I've spent so much time building race cars, weight savings is just a natural part of the build for me.... When I'm doing a street car, I've got to remember to dial in a bit of longevity on the fabricated pieces as well.... The requirements for a 9 second car are a bit different to the requirements of a cruizer! With the junk roads we have around this part of the country, I should build things a bit heavier but sometimes I just forget.... That's another reason I prefer moly on the suspension pieces, so much stronger then steel.... I also see that you used the weld in threaded bungs on your bars... The big deal used to be to use a tube that you could direct thread.....I pulled the threads on a few of those bars and have since gone back to the weld in bungs!!!!
Gee, I thought all the bad roads were in Luziana!:LOL:
If the road I drive to work gets any worse I'll need Bigfoot to get there!:eek:
Nice work hotrod! I wish I had a tenth of your skill in metal work. Oh well, I think if I can get my truck on the road this summer I'll be happy. No room at home for off the body work, not to mention the tools! I love looking at stuff you guys do though! Steve:D
Mike, I have to tell you how impressed I am with the way you are doing your car. Absolutely great stuff, and you are explaining it in a way that makes it so enjoyable to read. I look forward to every installment.
Starting to look like a car, huh??? :3dSMILE: Nice proportions and just a cool look to everything. You are really gonna have a nice ride there.
Tough hiding those receipts from the Little Lady isn't it? :p When I was building my '27 I would get to the checking account statement before she saw it and remove a few pages. One day she beat me home. :eek: :eek: Her only question was "How much money ARE YOU SPENDING on this car???? Makes us feel like a little boy who got his fingers caught in the cookie jar when that happens. :HMMM:
But Honey, I thought you said you liked me because I was a Bad Boy??? . :LOL:
Don
Don I use the under 200 rule and pray to god she doesn't say anything. So far so good!:DQuote:
Originally Posted by Itoldyouso
Thanks guys.
Steve, hang in there. You'll get it done. I know it's said a lot, but you really don't need a lot of tools to do this work. The tools mostly just speed things up. I did about 95% of the work on my 46 with little more than Lincoln welder, a cutting torch, grinder and a drill press. I literally started buildig it under a shade tree.
Don. The writing part is a lot harder for me than the building!:eek: I usually do it off line and edit it a few times before I post it. As far as the money goes, I really have an understanding wife and I'm very thankful.:)
Mike
Very nice work, Mike. I enjoy reading your thread. I, too, have built things, thought about what I was doing, and then started over with heavier material. I wonder if that is a common happening to all of us "home fabricators".:HMMM: :rolleyes:
I, too, have an understanding wife. It wasn't always that way; when we were first married, I had to match every dollar I spent with money for her to spend on whatever she wanted. I was building chopped bikes back then and I effectively paid for each one of them twice.:( After 37 years of marraige, though, she just lets me "do my thing" and says she doesn't want to know... Once I was typing something on this forum about how much I have spent on my coupe. She happened to walk behind me just as I typed $7600. She stopped, looked at it, and said something like "It's worth a more than that, isn't it?" I said "yes, a lot more". She said "I thought so" and walked away. There's never been another word about it or what I've spent so far on the roadster. If she'll have me, I think I'll stick around for another 20 or 30 years.:o :LOL:
Thanks JR.
I was wondering how your build is going. The last post I saw was the rear nerf bar. BTW I may "steal" the nerf idea.:rolleyes:
About the "matching" thing. I think I see some new furniture in my future!:HMMM: Oh well, it could be a LOT worse!:LOL:
Mike
Well, the rear nerf is the last thing I did.:o I've gotten temporarily sidetracked on some things I had been putting off. Hopefully I'll be back at it shortly. I'm just a couple of good productive weekends away from blowing it apart for final welding, grinding, paint prep, etc.:HMMM:
On the subject of re-making things; I think I'm going to re-make the sector shaft extension so that I can incorporate a support near the end where it passes through the body... I'll keep you all posted.;)
I finally got around to finishing the pitman arm. I first used regular bolts to connect the flange and arm. Ran into an "oops" situation with that idea. The arm and the lower 4-bar link are pretty close together and the bolt heads hit the bar. Had to fall back on "Plan B". I counterbored the bolt holes and used socket head cap screws. It looks better this way too, I think. Still pretty tight, but there should be plenty of clearance now.
I also gusseted the interior of the spindle steering arm. That pretty much finishes the steering, except for a new drag link and tie rod.
I stuck the steering shaft and steering wheel on temporarily to see how it would work. I had been expecting the steering effort to be high due to the length of the pitman arm. I was surpirised when it was actually very easy(almost like power steering:eek: ), in spite of being only 2 turns lock to lock! This thing is going to steer like a go-cart! Now I'm wondering now just how much weight is on the front end.:HMMM: I don't think it's much more that 600-700 lbs.
I also dropped a 700 transmission off at my trans guy's shop. Took awhile to run him down since he not only had opened up his own place, but had also moved to another town!
After talking about my project, this is what we came up with:
A good rebuild with the maximum number of clutch discs in each clutch pack.
A shift kit and Corvette type servo.
A 2200-2400 stall converter.
Modify to lock up in OD without electrical signal
Not exactly ground breaking stuff, but it should get the job done.
Mike
Pitman arm looks really nice with the Allen head bolts!? Very nice work!
Thanks Dave.
Sometimes when things don't work like I wanted, I get lucky and actually come up with something better!:):LOL:
Mike
Hi mike the T bucket is looking good. Will it be ready for jackson? You owe me a ride you know. hope to see yall soon. john s.
John
Yeah, I hope to be finished by then. I'll gladly pay you back. Looking forward to it.
Mike
Is that quick steering, it seems like it to me. I am wondering how tricky it will be to drive. I have never driven one so I am very curious, thanks.
That steering arm did turn out looking very cool, nicely done.
Thanks Brickman.
I'm wondering the same thing.:HMMM:
I know the steering on my 46 is about 2 1/2 turns lock to lock(MII power rack). It was plenty "touchy" until I put on a Heidt's adjustable pressure valve and dialed back on the pump pressure.
I wasn't joking about the steering effort on the T. It actually feels like weak power steering! The quarter elipitical setup really stretches the wheelbase without adding much extra weight to the frontend. I think that extra length made the front pretty light. I based this setup on the Zipper Motors layout and they're supposed to be good drivers.
We'll just have to wait and see how it drives.:HMMM: It's a big gamble!:eek:
Zipper motors set-up? Where would someone go to study that a little?
Mike, I poured over your pictures several times, really interesting to look at all the nice touches you are putting in it. Very smart too reinforcing that hairpin steering arm.
It was cool seeing the flamecutter making your steering arm. It did a very clean job on a thick piece like that. As for your steering being too quick, my T is 5 3/4 turns lock to lock and is way too slow IMO. Just today I backed it out of the shop and had to crank and crank to turn it sharply. Yours should end up just about right I bet.
Keep the pics coming......love looking at them.:)
Don