That's so cool! Thanks for the reply Jim..
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That's so cool! Thanks for the reply Jim..
Well, in order to keep this thing running I need to have the cooling system working and to do that I need to have the alternator mounted so I can put a belt on... Is that a run-on sentence? Anyway, to accomplish this I had to make a couple of changes and fabricate some bracketry. First, I had to swap the '87 water pump for an '86. The '87 S-10 used a serprntine belt and the water pump runs backwards to the engine. The '86 and earlier S-10 used a v-belt system and the water pump runs the same direction as the engine. I couldn't find a 1986 or older S-10 in any of the local salvage yards, but I did manage to score the crank pulley off a 1985 Pontiac Fiero. The water pump pulley is one I found in my spare parts pile; I don't know what it came from, but it's probably from a small-block Chevy as I have parts from a few of them in the shed.
Near the bottom of the block on the driver's side, there is a protrusion with two threaded holes. There's plenty of open space on this side of the engine, too, so this is where I decided to mount the alternator :cool:(the opposite side has the bottom radiator hose and water pump inlet in the way).
I used a piece of heavy duty (1/4" wall thickness) 1 1/2" angle iron cut and drilled to fit the boss at the bottom of the block. The length of this piece was carefully measured to place the alternator so that the pulleys all line up. I made two tabs from 1 1/4" x 3/16" flat stock. I found a spacer that was the same length as the bolt boss on the alternator and used that to hold the tabs at the proper distance apart for welding. I also welded a 3/8"-16 nut on the rear tab.
After welding, I dressed the welds to remove any slag, shot the finished bracket with a coat of Krylon primer, and painted it with "As-cast Aluminum Silver". The top adjuster arm is another Chevy part that I cut, reshaped, and welded to attach to another available threaded hole on the front of the engine.
Of course, the stupid pictures never load in order on this crappy progam, so I hope you can figure out what you're seeing...:rolleyes:
Clean and simple, ought to work great Jim!!!!
You make it look easy Jim! Nice.
Looks good to me too!
Sooo glad you are back on this!
Really looking forward to you driving this cool build.
OK, the last thing I did was build the alternator mount. With that in place I was able to put a belt on it to run the water pump. Problem was, I hadn't been able to plumb the radiator hoses yet because (1) the radiator is inside the nose and the cap is inaccessable, so (2) the car needs a remote filler. As with everything else on this engine choice, there is no commercially available solution, so I had to fabricate something...:whacked:
The solution became apparent while I was roaming my local salvage yard (the place where I get most of my parts). I found a nifty little bolt-on filler assembly on a Nissan 300-Z. All I needed to do was fabricate a means to utilize it. On the right front corner of the engine there was a factory loop for hoisting the engine. Most of us usually take these off and trash 'em to clean up the looks of our engines, but I'm glad I hadn't done so yet. I used the hoist loop to make the bracket for my auxilary fill tank. The tank itself I made from a 4 inch piece of 2" x 3" x 14 gauge tubing. I drilled the holes to mount the filler assembly, welded 1/4-20 nuts inside, and capped the ends with pieces of 1/16 x 2 flat stock.:HMMM:
After building the tank, I cut the (hoist loop) bracket to fit and welded it in place. This actually took a few trial fits to get everything in place where I could still connect the hoses and also close the hood without interference. Once the tank was mounted, I made a trip to the local parts store to find a useable upper hose. I needed an "S" shape to snake the hose around and give it enough length that it could flex when the engine moves under acceleration. I've been in the local Advance Auto Parts enough that they now let me search out my own hoses. After about 45 minutes of picking through their inventory, I found what looked like a good candidate. I could now determine where I needed the hose connections. I cut some 1 inch black iron pipe to fit the appropriate angles, hole-sawed the openings in the tank, and welded the pipe/hose connections in place. All that was left was to paint the tank, bolt it on for the final time, and connect the hoses. I ran out of time today, but tomorrow I'll fill the system and put "fire in the hole" again.
Of course this dumb ass program uploaded the pictures out of order again:mad:, but you all can figure it out from the text...
Neat solution! Can't wait 'til your drivin' it!
Yep, that's a neat little tank! You're lucky to have a salvage yard that allows you to roam around looking at stuff. The only ones around here who do that are a couple of "pick'n pull" lots. All the bigger places have front counters and sell parts by year & model, just like the box stores...
A tip on the pictures - once you upload them hit the "Preview Post" button to see how they're arranged (they'll likely be backwards/out of order). Then it's pretty easy to highlight & drag or cut & paste them into the right places, and even add text between frames if that helps. Thanks for taking time to post them!!
Nice solution Jim. Looks cool too! Nice to see this one getting closer to the road!
Thanks, Roger. I didn't know you could do that. I'll try it. I'm almost computer illiterate; it's a miracle I can resize the pictures!:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by rspears
Jim,
I've been enjoying watching the birth of another Track-T Roadster. I too have a soft spot for the pioneers who raced the T back in the 30's.
http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/...201014x760.jpg
Wow, Bob, that's a nice looking T. Can we see some more pictures? What's under the louvered hood?
Sure Jim, as I've enjoyed your build.
From this picture you will see I've "massaged" the aluminum panel a bit with the bulge to allow clearance for the engine's Ram Horn exhaust manifold.
http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/...981014x760.jpg
In the beginning the transmission was a M21 Muncie 4 speed.
http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/...341014x760.jpg
But that was when I was running a 355 sbc circle track race engine. Later I built a 383 sbc for torque down low in the rpm band, gave up 100 hp on the high end to have 516 lb/ft @ 2800 on the low end.
http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/...1014x760-1.jpg
That amount of torque would have made the Muncie short lived, so swapped in a Tremec TKO 600 5 speed with 0.64 5th gear.
With the massive torque so low in the rpm band, was able to gear it really tall for cruising and good mpg. Broke 30 mpg on a couple of trips. This picture is up hill in 5th and about 1025 rpm.
http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/...911014x760.jpg
As much as I enjoyed the grunt of the 383 over the 355, I missed the high rpm zing of the 355, so the next engine gave that back to me. You probably won't have to go to the extremes I've had to in keeping the engine cool with a radiator that fits inside our track noses, but mine is a 3 core and 2 core married to the same tanks and then a custom fabbed fan shroud to pull as much air as possible through it.
http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/...pse543475b.jpg
What can I say? NICE, NICE, NICE!! I love track T's and what a nice specimen you have built!:D Those old Muncie 4-speeds used to hold up fairly well behind some pretty beefy big-blocks in cars a lot heavier than your T, but the 5-speed is a nice upgrade anyway.:cool:
If I am unhappy with my 4-banger when I get this thing on the road, it will get replaced with a small-block. Lack of extra $$$ now that I'm retired will keep it mild-mannered, though. That 427 small-block must be a handful when you stomp the "loud pedal".:eek::3dSMILE: I like it; I wish I could see it in person...
Good news; I finally had the roadster running long enough to get the thermostat open and get the coolant circulating.:3dSMILE: The engine seems to run good, no smoke, and no unwanted noises. The bad news is it won't idle.:( I have checked for vacuum leaks and played with the timing to no avail. Apparently the old junkyard carburetor has an internal problem and will need a rebuild (or replacement).
With the engine in running order, I have reached the point where I need to keep tabs on what's happening internally, so I need to get the gauges mounted and working. That means I need to fabricate the dash panel! I could build another wood masterpiece like I did for my coupe, but this track-T is supposed to replicate an old race car and back in the days of the "Roaring Roadsters" the interiors were very spartan. Often, the cars only had an oil pressure gauge and some had no gauges at all! As the roadsters evolved more and more toward sprint cars and the engines became more radical and expensive, gauges became necessary, so dash panels of some sort became common. Certainly, a dash panel would be utilitarian and therefore made of steel or aluminum. Since the beginning of this build I have intended to make the dash from aluminum and engine turn it to match the firewall.
I began by making a pattern from my good old standby template material, poster board. This Dave Koorey body has a dash in it that is pretty narrow (measured vertically), so there is limited space for fitting the gauges. The problem here is compounded by the under-dash support structure that I built to accomodate the cowl steering; everything has to be mounted to the right of the steering column. Therefore, the gauges have to be clustered near the center of the dash panel. After a lot of cut & try fitting, taping my mistakes back together, and cutting again, I finally arrived at a shape I like. The first pic is the finished pattern taped in place. Next is the pattern being transferred to the back of the .063" aluminum (You can see all the taped mistakes on the back of the pattern here). the last pic is the aluminum panel with the gauges fit into it. These are Dolphin gauges; black face with curved glass similar to old-time Stewart Warners.:cool:
Very cool, and the cut & tape is why poster board is such a great tool!! Looking forward to how you accomplish the engine turning, to keep everything aligned & symmetrical. Always been intrigued by that design.
Looks great Jim, getting anxious for the road test on this one I'd bet??????
Jim nice simple dash. I like the gauges in the middle. my current convertable has the speedo under where your left hand sits on the steering wheel, making it hard to see what speed your doing. My old jeep cj7 had the center mount gauges which I always liked, long of the short should work well there.
The M22 Muncie or "Rock Crusher" would of had no longevity problems with 516 lb/ft of the old 383, but I had the M21 that was used with the small blocks. Great trans and I still have it.Quote:
Originally Posted by J. Robinson
As to the loud pedal, you will soon find out that when the car weighs less than 1800 lbs (probably less than 1600 lbs in your case), it will hook and book. I can't roll it all on in 1st, but if I short shift at 30 mph into 2nd, my rpm is low enough that I can roll it all on and if road surface is good, will hold traction all the way to 60 mph before it starts losing traction. 3rd gear never a problem, so hang on.
Dave - Yes! I'm anxious for that first time around the block. Soon, very soon... I hope.:HMMM:
Steve - My coupe has the gauges in the center, too, and they're easy to read that way. I plan to mount the tachometer on the steering column like '50s - '60s era; that's why there isn't one in the dash.:cool:
Bob - I don't know what this thing weighs yet, but it's pretty light. My son and one of his buddies grabbed the front bumper one day and lifted the car up so the buddy's girlfriend could get the jackstands out from under it!:eek: Even with the little 4-banger it should be fun to drive...:3dSMILE:
I left off last time with the aluminum cut to shape and hole-sawed for the gauges. Next step was to re-fit the panel in the car, mark the gauge holes, and cut out clearance in the fiberglass for the gauges. Also, I drilled the mounting holes that will hold the whole thing in place. The good news here was the two end holes went right into the steel support underneath, so I was able to tap the holes and permanently install studs. The two holes that are close to the gauges get bolts with big fender washers to spread the pressure on the back side.;)
With all the holes drilled, it's time to finish the panel. I used my cordless drill and a 1 inch diameter wire brush (same as I used on the firewall). The pattern is achieved by using a straight edge fixture (I used a 1 x 4 board) clamped in place to guide the rows of brushed circles in a straight line. Controlling the drill is a challenge at first, so I recommend practicing on a scrap piece until you “get the hang of it”. Start at one end of the top or bottom edge and work all the way across, overlapping each circle by one half the diameter. I am left-handed, so I find it easier to control the drill / brush if I start at the top and work from right to left. When I finish a row I move the guide one half the diameter of the brush and do the next row. There is another detailed explanation of the process back on page 27 of this thread. Once done with the "engine turning" process, I cleaned the panel with wax & grease remover, loaded my spray gun, and gave the panel three wet coats of clear acrylic urethane. The last pic below shows the finished panel with chrome acorn nuts holding the panel in place and the gauges installed.:3dSMILE:
I like your choice of dash, we think alike. That is a spring loaded glove compartment door of the same material as the dash.
http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/...021014x760.jpg
Thanks for the explanation of the engine turning process, Jim. I had vague memories of reading something years ago about valve lapping compound and a dowel but your rotary brush worked pretty slick!
And IMHO, if you have access to a drill press the job can be accomplished with more accuracy and consistency.
Bob - Thanks. Great minds think alike. I like having a glove compartment (I put one in my coupe) and I may steal your idea...:cool:
Roger - I have also heard of the dowel rod & valve lapping compound and I have seen some absolutely beautiful examples of the finished product, but I have never tried it. It must take forever to finish a panel that way. I came up with this wire brush and straight-edge process back in 1975 when I was building Quarter Midgets for my nephews and I used it again on the firewall of my C-Cab hotrod in '76. Using this method, once I get a rythm going, I achieve brushed dots or circles at the rate of about one per second. I soon found out that greasy fingerprints are almost impossible to remove from the raw aluminum surface, hence the clearcoat that I use now.:HMMM:
NTFDAY - Yes, I agree that a drill press could / would produce more consistency, but it would require building some kind of fixture to hold the workpiece and move it accurately in a straight line. Also, the depth of the throat on a drill press would limit the size of the workpiece which would have been a problem on my firewall (see page 27).:whacked:
Know what you mean. it's how I did it in 61 when I was in high school
You beat me. I used the 'ol dowel with suction cup and compound in 1966 on my Briggs & Stratton mini bike engine then in 1969 on my 200 cid Ford Falcon engine.Quote:
Originally Posted by NTFDAY
There are "kits" advertised that consist of an abrasive stick, either 1/2" or 1" OD - the bigger one comes with a mandrel. Instructions say to use a lube, like WD40, applied to each position, and to use consistent time & pressure in a drill press, dressing the stick with 220grit sand paper every three or four holes to remove any mushrooming. An old school demo showed a guy using an end mill with the stop adjusted to just kiss the surface, overlapping 40%. Talk about time consuming!!
I haven't done much of anything this week that's picture-worthy. I added the light and ignition switches to the dash panel, stuck in some indicator lights for turn signals and bright headlights, and I have begun the mundane and tedious task of wiring... Until I get to something a bit more interesting, I thought this might be a good time to update the cost of this project.:HMMM: I haven't updated the total since page 33. That was in September of 2008! Since then I bought the Kirkey aluminum seats, bought the front tires from my son (off his sedan with only 50 miles on them), and have plumbed the brakes, fuel, and cooling systems.:rolleyes:
Total brought forward from 9-16-08: $3126.96
Front tires: 60.00
Kirkey seats (Speedway Motors): 364.72
Parts (water pump, alternator,etc.): 146.72
Materials (steel, resin, aluminum): 111.95
Nuts, bolts, washers: 115.46
Total (5-3-13) $3925.81
Looks like I might still come in under my (revised) $4500 goal, but it's going to be close...:3dSMILE:
You sure get excellent bang for the buck. You would call Nick and I foolish for what we paid for our Dart 427 engines, when your able to build the entire car for less than 1/2 the engine cost. I tip my hat to you sir, BTW, some of us would be interested in pictures of stuffing the dash.Quote:
Originally Posted by J. Robinson
Nice progress on your project, Jim. I've always loved the look of engine turned sheet metal like on your dash.
Depending on one's perspective, I'm sure some would agree with that, Bob. But I thought long and hard about the best way for me to get to where I wanted to be within the time frame and resources I have, and I still have zero regrets or second guesses about where I am now.Quote:
Originally Posted by deckofficer
As long as one gets what he or she wants honestly and enjoys it, it is not foolish. I like what I see of your cars in the pictures and if you guys are happy with your rides, I would be the last one to condemn you for what you spent on them. There are a lot of folks who think we're all nuts for spending our time and money on "obsolete old cars" when we could have a "pretty new one" with modern accessories.:HMMM:
As for me, I couldn't cough up the cash for one of those engines or a Brookville body if my life depended on it, but that doesn't mean it's foolish. It simply means I don't have expendable income in large enough sums. I have a few bucks here and there occasionally and I make do with it. It's been that way all my life and that's OK. My lifelong financial status forced me to learn to make the things I couldn't afford to buy and I discovered that I enjoy fabrication! In my 65 years I have truly become a "Jack of all trades" and I frequently trade fabrication skills (automotive or household) for something I need.:cool: My favorite part of building a car is chassis and suspension fabrication. Everything else is just necessary to finish the vehicle...
I was going to skip the wiring phase in this thread, but if you think it's noteworthy I'll post some pics and updates soon.:3dSMILE:
So does that mean you aren't using wire on your build Jim ? Have one developed something new to get the electricity ( lick-a- tres- tee ) from the tomato sauce to the candle sticks ?:HMMM::confused:;)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whiplash23T
Whip: you put me in mind of this wee story I read in a magazine many years ago.
I don't know who wrote it or what magazine it was in, but I liked it!
Everything you wanted to know about auto electricals.
I will now reveal to you everything you wanted to know about electricity. Forget all that nonsense about magnetic fields and the flow of electrons along a conductor, for it is just that, nonsense…….a myth put about by Auto Electricians to support their lavish lifestyles at your expense. The reality is…….Smoke!
When you think about it, it all becomes startlingly obvious. Smoke makes all electrical things function, and if the smoke escapes the component stops working. For example, the last time you had to grovel under your car to replace the starter motor, didn’t it start smoking before it stopped working? Of course it did!
The wiring loom in your car carries smoke from one device to another, pumped around the system by the dynamo, and when a wire springs a leak it lets all the smoke out and everything stops. The starter motor requires lots of smoke to work properly, so it has a very thick wire going to it.
The battery stores up lots of smoke dissolved in the battery acid, which is why they were once called accumulators, until it became apparent that we unwashed home mechanics would twig to the secret. Naturally, if you try to store too much smoke in your battery it will escape through those little holes in the top, which is why those newfangled batteries with sealed tops explode when they get too much smoke in them.
With regard to Joseph Lucas and his wrongfully sullied reputation, why is he so maligned? Why are Lucas components more likely to leak smoke than, say, Bosch or Marrelli? It’s because Lucas is British, and British things always leak. British motorcycles leak oil, British sports cars leak rain, British hydrolastic units leak fluid, and British Governments leak military secrets.
So, naturally, British electrical components leak smoke.
.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whiplash23T
Good one!:LOL::LOL::LOL: Actually I thought there has been so much written about wiring that no one would be interested in that part, but if you all want to see it I'll post it.:rolleyes: For the first time, I am using a partial pre-fabbed kit (it was a gift); all my previous wiring jobs have been scratch-built one-wire-at-a-time. They all worked (and most still are), but weren't always pretty. Each one gets a little better, though, so we'll see...:HMMM:
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnboy
Johnboy - I saw that article somewhere before, too. It pretty much expresses how I felt about wiring when I delved into my first wiring job and sometimes I wonder if maybe it is correct after all.:confused: I had a problem with the ballast resistor on my coupe one time...:eek: Nah, long story... Anyway, suffice it to say that the lessons learned through mistakes sometimes make the most lasting impressions.:whacked::3dSMILE: