Yahoo Dan! Don't cut this frame up after it is done (inside joke):LOL::LOL:
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Yahoo Dan! Don't cut this frame up after it is done (inside joke):LOL::LOL:
I hid the sawzall. :LOL::LOL:
Picked up the frame today on my lunch hour. It is all sandblasted and ready for us to do some grinding and maybe filling this weekend. The Tiger Drylac stuff came in today also, so we should be ready to rock and roll. Problem is, the entire can is in German .:confused: Guess I need to go to their website and see if they have directions in English.
The powder coater would like it back by Thursday of next week so that it doesn't start rusting on us.
Don
Don,
This may help in the translation...
http://www.google.com/webmasters/igoogle/translate.html
Have fun...
OK... What is Tiger Drylac? Is that some kind of filler that is heat resistant so it can withstand the baking process of powder coating?:confused:
Thanks for the German/ American translator. May have to use it. :)
Yep Jim, the full name is Tiger Drylac EPO Strong, and that is exactly what it is, a heat resistant "bondo." Another member, Streetwerkz, is in the powder coating business and suggested it as being superior to other brands we had heard about, like Lab metal, or All metal. I spoke to the factory rep and he confirmed that it was designed for this application and withstands something like 240 degrees of heat.
We are going to use it just as we would have done with regular filler, skim coat pretty much the entire frame and DA it down smooth. Probably ending up with 150 grit. Then it goes back to the coater for a primer coat and a couple of coats of gloss black. The Drylac is two part, but for some reason you have to wait 24 hours to sand it, so if we apply it today we should be able to start sanding tomorrow. It is warming up this weekend, so that should help.
I'll post some pictures as we go.
Don
I sure wish that I could have found that "stuff" before I did my frame but my 'coater said that there was really nothing that he really liked, that every product seemed to have some level of problems. Regardless, my TCI frame had very nicely ground welds, especially in the very visible front and whatever I put down had at least the rough edges shaved off before it went to be done and the coating softened them even more. Then of course, mine is a full fendered car and very few welds aft of the firewall can be seen anyhow:LOL::LOL::LOL:
Don, I hope you document the before, during and after nicely for us as this has been a subject of much interest by many:toocool:
Don, I hope you document the before, during and after nicely for us as this has been a subject of much interest by many:toocool:[/QUOTE]
I will try to take pictures all through the process. Dan is still leery that the powder coat will not come out as good as he wants, but we figure if worst comes to worst we will scuff and spray it. At least it will have a good base that should be pretty good at rust prevention and the powder should get back into all those spots we could not reach with a gun. When I picked up the frame yesterday they had pictures on the wall of previous jobs they had done. Lots of motorcyles and a few cars. One car in particular was the undersides and they did all the parts in several colors. It looked very show worthy, so I am more optimistic than he is.
We'll see. :):)
Don
We spent today doing our very least favorite thing...........sanding and grinding. :( It took about 10 hours, but we got the newly sandblasted frame smooth and clean enough that we could start applying the filler. I would like to say the Drylac stuff is easy to work with, but it isn't. First of all, it is very heavy and dense, so it spreads a little on the thick side. And it is VERY hard to get off of you when it starts to cure. We went through quite a bit of laquer thinner and a bunch of rags because it got all over everything. We used both kits up, but got most of the frame side rails skim coated.
The directions say if you air dry it the filler takes 2-3 days to dry for sanding. It also said you have 4 hours working time, but it was starting to kick after about an hour, so we had to work pretty fast. I hope it sands like the rep from the company said, but it seems a lot like JB weld to me. We are going to sand most of it back off, and if it is tough to sand we have our work cut out for us.
Anyway, here are some pictures of when we got started and what we ended up with just before we applied the filler. I didn't want to take any pictures after the filler was on because it was also all over my hands, and I didn't want to ruin my camera. :) I'll take some pictures tomorrow .
Don
I know photos don't always show all the little details, but that frame looks perfect already. It's going to be beautiful.:3dSMILE: Is Dan sure he wants to cover up all that work with a body?:rolleyes::LOL::LOL:
He's a slave driver Jim! I was thinking about calling the Elderly Abuse Hotline and turning him in. :LOL: I was ready to smear mud on the frame after a little grinding, but like I mentioned, it took 10 hours until it was smooth enough for him. Perfect is kind of a subjective, overused word, and this frame won't be perfect, but he just wants it as good as possible out of a home garage. It really makes you think what the guys who go after awards like Ridler must go through.
We got in bed at 4:30 this morning and get to do this all over again today.:( I HATE bodywork.
Don
I'm with JR it looks great to begin with.
I'm also with you Don, I hate filler and body work. And I really hate welding sheet metal body parts!:CRY:
It'll be interesting to see where the filler fills in, since in your shots it really does look perfect. (then again so does my truck from about 30 yards away!):LOL:
Keep posting pics.
Welding in some of the bracing distorted the metal sidewalls a little, nothing major, but it raised up the surface in a couple of spots. We ground them flush, but to make them disappear totally we needed a skim coat of the filler. He also radiused some of the welds with the filler too.
We're heading over there now to see if it dried enough to cure it (I doubt it as they say 2-3 days for a total cure) but we can at least get some other parts ready to take to the powder coater tomorrow.
Don
I didn't think you could us filler for powder coating... did you use something different?
Yep, it is a filler that is heat resistant and conductive so it will take a charge so the powder sticks. Streetwerkz on here put me onto it and I checked it out on the internet and phoned the company. Not real cheap, but not real bad either.......about $ 50 a quart. We used two quarts and just made it.
We are about to find out how tough it is to sand. The rep said it is easy, but easy is a relative term. :LOL:
Don
If you don't mind, what is the product's name so I can add it to my database of stuff I need to remember (so henceforth I have to write it down)!
Tbucket read this thread for detailsQuote:
Originally Posted by 25T_Bucket
http://www.clubhotrod.com/forums/sho...er+coat+filler
Quote:
Originally Posted by stovens
Great thread... I've contacted Tiger Drylac so see if they have a local vendor for the Epo Strong product.
Thanks for the help!
25T, I ordered directly from the factory and it came in a few days. They ship out of Pennsylvania and Texas (I think).......mine came from Pa. They have some little hoop you have to jump through where they only sell to accounts, so you have to set up one, but the goofy part is you don't have to be a business.:confused: I told her it was for personal use and she said that was ok, but they faxed me a simple form which I filled out and sent back, and they assign you an account number. They called me back in 5 minutes and said "Ok, you are set up, what do you want to order."
To give you some perspective on quantity, we bought two kits and each one seems to be about a quart I would guess. The filler is in about a two quart can and is about half full, and the hardner is in another can and is half that much (it is a two to one ratio). We went on line and downloaded English directions because the can and everything is in what I think is German. Nice people to deal with and very good service.
Last night we went to the shop to see if the filler had cured, and found it to almost be so, but not quite. We didn't want to take any chances trying to sand it too soon, but we did take one spot and tried sanding it and it seems to sand pretty easily. Not like the JB weld I thought it might be like, although it smells just like JB weld. We decided to give it a day or so more before we sand it again because the weather has been pretty cool lately and it wouldn't have baked as it normally would here in Florida.
What we did do was get a lot of parts ready to take to the powder coater this morning. We finished sanding stuff like his rear housing and other parts and Dan dropped them off today. He found out they also carry Tiger Drylac powder at our local coater and they consider that their high end stuff. Dan opted for that brand and also is having them clear coat the parts when done to give them more depth.
Here are a few pictures we took so that we can make sure all the parts come back when done.
Don
Thanks for the reply... You are correct, The TIGER Drylac Epo Strong repair kit is stocked at Tiger Drylac in Reading, PA. So if anyone wants to order the kit, there e-mail address is:
customerserviceeast@tiger-coatings.us
or phone # 610-926-8148.
Wow. That's a lot of parts. I never thought about powder coating the drums, but what a great idea! Since I'm running slot mags they show right through the holes. It's funny what you don't think about until you see it done on another car. The transaxle housing must have been a real pain to clean out all the fluid! This should ure look nice when done.Quote:
Originally Posted by Itoldyouso
It's a brand new housing from Moser, so it just needed a few rough spots dressed up. Made it nice to work with. Can't wait to see this stuff come back. :)
Don
Don did you do any sanding today? JUst curious how it went. I thought the transaxle looked new! It should be really nice when it comes back!Quote:
Originally Posted by Itoldyouso
No, we both were too tired after work to stop at the shop..........first part of the week is a bear at work. We are going to try to make it tomorrow night.
Don
sanding the Epo strong I like to start with 80 grit, apply light-medium pressure with your DA sander.
wear thick blue jeans, so you can clean your sand paper, as the Epo strong likes to clog sand paper.
most of all, be patient, and take your time, if your just trying to rush thru, it will turn out like crap.
I usually go 80 grit, 120, 240, 400 with DA, then 400 by hand with a block
Good tips, thanks. I'll tell you, it is some pretty strong stuff and adheres like mad. We had a couple of drips that we wanted to remove after they had set up for a day, they were stuck like glue and took some real effort to remove.
Should have no problem sticking to the bare frame.
Don
It's been about 10 days since we got Dan's frame back from being sandblasted, and the next step was to apply the Tiger Drylac filler, let it cure, and then sand it down until all the imperfections were minimized. We got the stuff on ok, and let it cure a few days, then started to sand it off. I would like to say that it sands off like butter, but I would be lying. It is a b**** to sand. I have sanded tougher stuff, but it is nowhere as easy as regular filler. We spent about 2 hours on it and got about 1 foot done and used up 6 DA sandpaper discs, so we decided to go another route. We cheated and took it to the bodyshop that painted my T and Don's T and told them to do it for us. :D
We dropped it off last Wednesday, and they said we could pick it up on Friday. We didn't care how much it cost, we just wanted it done, and we didn't want to do any more on it ourselves. Friday came and went, and on Monday I called them. They said they were still working on it and would have it done maybe that day. Finally, on Tuesday I went by and they told me we could take it home.
The bodyman who actually did the work asked me what the h*** that filler was. He used up a whole box of discs and longboard paper and two days work. He said he thought he would never get it done. But it did come out nice. When we got it back to the shop Dan and I spent 6 hours more hand sanding and DA-ing it even smoother, and I have to say it came out nice. Dan dropped it off at the powder coater this morning. His other stuff is still not done getting coated, so we hope we get some stuff back before the weekend so we can continue putting parts together. He placed an order with Stainless Specialities for enough grade 9 polished stainless bolts to put the whole thing together.
Here are a couple of pictures of the frame all ready to go to the powder coater. You can see the filler where it is sanded down. Maybe in a week or two we can have this thing up on wheels for the first time. :D:D
Don
WOW, getting exciting now guys! Glad for you, but not for the sanding part. :D UGH. That must be nutz. Not much happening here, just biding my time until we get warmer weather and I can get out into the garage again. Been playing model trains meantime, nice and warm in the basement train room. Good to see your progress. Perley :)
Look's slick can't wait to see it powder coated.
BradC
Looking good Don ..... I'm sure your antzy to get it back & start the "building" process.
I looked at my car today ......... progress soon.
Ratty 46
Thanks guys.
Perley, we are getting a taste of your weather here lately, and tonight is supposed to be the coldest, down in the 20's they say. :eek: Only thing I can say is it was a lot more pleasant last night sanding that frame and not sweating back into the clean metal. Otherwise, you can keep cold weather.
Brad, I'm more excited than Dan, I think. This is going to be the thing that FINALLY puts this car over the top as far as finishing it. Up until now it has been fabrication, fabrication, fabrication. When it comes home we can actually start putting it together for the very last time. We are going to pickup a length of carpet remnant this week, big enough so we can assemble the entire car on it without scratching the pretty stuff.
Ratty, yeah Paul, been wondering what you have been up to. Did those new wheels show up yet?
Don
Wheels arrived & they are better than I figured they would have been. I've just ordered my front brakes & coil overs & only need a few things to really start the build back process. I hope I can closely match what you guys have done.
Paul
You know Paul, I have all these neat 46 Ford parts sitting around, and I bet you are too busy to build this car, so maybe it might fit on my trailer and.................................;) (sorry, I'm an incurable mooch :o)
Glad you are going to get back on it. Post up some pictures when you do.
Don
Don, Dan's frame looks great. It's funny in the bare metal photos it looked perfect, but with the filler you can see the low spots because of the color difference. It must be reassuring how hard it was that filler didn't want to come off. You'll know it will stand up to just about anything after powder coating is done!
I know it's only thursday, but any word yet on the frame. (acting like a kid in a candy store)lol
BradC
Quote:
Originally Posted by BradC
Hehe, I'm the same way, I even stopped by yesterday to check on it and the frame was hanging sideways on a big rack, ready to roll into the booth. Dan was having a hard time making them understand that it didn't need blasted again, and I wanted to make sure they didn't screw up and do that. They didn't blast it and were taping off the holes when I got there. I told them that we were going to retap all the holes anyway, so let the coating go right down into them.
They said it might be done today (Friday) and when I asked about all the other parts they said all of them were in the oven right now, letting the final clear coat cook. So it looks like we might be able to get everything today, or at least all of the small parts. :D
Have to pick up a piece of carpeting to pad the trailer with, so that will give me an excuse to stop by and maybe be able to get some of the parts out of their way. Dan plays tomorrow, but if all goes well Sunday we can start bolting this thing together. :):)
Don
I ain't never paintin' another part in my life!!! :D I just picked up the loose parts we took to the powder coater and man, are they nice!!:D We couldn't have painted them to look as smooth and glossy. We had the extra step of having them all clear coated on top of the black, and it really made a difference.
The frame was baking on the final coat when I was there, so we can probably get it later on today. Can't wait to see that thing all done. This is so easy.....drop off raw parts and then pick them up all done and ready to install. Why have we been wasting our time spraying this stuff all our lives? :confused:
I had to pull a little of the wrapping off to see what the parts looked like, but I left most of them for Dan to unwrap. But here is a preview. :)
Don
Very nice indeed...
Not bad, huh? :D I'm really stoked about this thing coming together. (finally, it's ONLY been 4 years :o) I just tracked his stainless steel bolt order, it is being delivered today too. Maybe by Sunday night this thing might actually be a roller. :D:D:D:D
Don
Don,
They sure look good! And it won't chip or dull with a little maintenance. I bet the frame will look awesome!
Ken
Hey, you're back!! :) How was the vacation? I have you and a bunch of other powder coater lovers to thank for pushing us in this direction. To me paint doesn't look nearly as good...........but that is just me.
Don