1940 Ford Tudor Build Thread

I managed to get more done on the frame on Saturday morning. I only have a small area of the bottom of the RH frame rail to finish welding. I ran out of gas for the welder or I would have finished it up. Either way I will have to finish the spots under my braces after I cut them off.

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x...920_132727.jpg
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My youngest brother helped me flip the frame over. You can see his arm and thumb in the above pic. Next step is to hack the leaf spring perches off the 9", and get the frame at ride height. Then mock up the triangulated 4 link at tack it in place.

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x...920_134825.jpg
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Once the rear suspension is in place, we'll set the body back on the frame and I will have to cut off the hacked MII and rebuild the front frame rails. Then it will be time for the new cross member. My new front wheels and cross member have arrived too. Now I need to decide on a front tire so I can try to have 2 front tires to use in mocking up the front end.

Time for shiny!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I decided on some 205/65R15's for mock up. I scored these off CL and we'll see how they look on the car fitment wise when some bigger pieces are back on the chassis. :LOL:

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x...924_143857.jpg

Today I drilled my frame and bolted the running boards back on. We set the frame on the floor just because. :LOL:

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x...925_121430.jpg

I also got the old leaf spring perches cut off. I have to go get more grinding wheels and I can clean the slag off and start mock up on the rear suspension.

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x...925_121348.jpg

Well at least your welding seems to be a lot better then the guy who was welding on it before you got it.
HE! HE! HE!
Kurt

Don't take much to get better than what they did. Looks like he missed some too.
LOL

They for sure missed areas. I'd hate to see if any of them actually built an entire car. :LOL:

I'm getting excited. This car might start looking like a car again instead of a heap of scattered pieces. :LOL:

Today I got the frame leveled out at a height I feel should be okay to drive around in. I keep thinking it needs to be lower, but I want to set it at a conservative level so I'm not ripping off parts. The front crossmember right now is 5 3/8" off the ground. The front of the running board is 4.5" and the rear is 6.5". These may not be perfect measurements because my fenders and body aren't on to help support the ends of the boards. It is a starting point though.

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x...926_113714.jpg
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Rear of frame

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x...926_113751.jpg

Front of frame

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x...926_113812.jpg

Trying to give different angles to capture the height. My shop floor is low on the RH side of the car.

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x...926_113846.jpg
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Now on to rear end mock up.

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Now I have to install my old rear wheels and tires to see where the rear axle height is so I can see how far I will have to notch the frame to give plenty of clearance.

I'm trying to get an idea of how much upstroke the rear suspension will have. Does 3-4" of clearance sound like plenty?

Ryan, you got me curious. I measured from the floor to the front and rear of the running boards - both about 7". The chin under the grille is around 5.5-6 (I did not have room to crawl under for a good measurement). My 40's chin has a lot of scratch marks from kissing parking curbs. It is an awful feeling to pull in somewhere and hear this screech and grinding sound. :HMMM: As low as you have the front set, you are going to have to be real careful of even the slow-down bumps in the roads and heaven help you on the wrong driveway. I suggest you talk to a few other 40 owners and see what they measure out. (photo taken in Mid Colorado with hail storm and flooding in Aug.) I have a lot more clearance than you are considering. You are tilting the front down a lot with those measurements.

Scooting, thanks. Yeah, I wish I would have measured this stuff before I removed my small block out. My car sat nose down severly before. I mean why wouldn't it? It had original MII or Pinto coil springs with 2 sets of spacers in them per side. My grill chin got smashed in Cedar Rapids Iowa in a severly high crowned intersecton. Not to mention I scraped some curbs or parking spot markers with it on occasion. From what I remember of my car, it sat like yours does except maybe a little higher in the rear. For now I'm just going to tack my brackets to the frame so if I have to reposition them after the front suspension is on, I can. My front cross member height is unknown at this point too. The welder series one I got, I can place the cross member at any height I want. My base line is no where and it is a little nerve racking. :LOL: And I guess if worst comes to worst, I can add a little more air to the front bags to bring it up. I can't believe it's almost been 3yrs since I tore this car apart!

I've been doing some research trying to make sure I can set up my triangulated 4 link and have it work and drive as nice as I can the first time. I think I'm going to raise my frame a little bit to help keep from destroying the front sheet metal and then get everything set in place and tack it all.

I have the uppers in an area I believe that is close right now. The RH upper mount on the axle housing needs to be taller to match the LH side. I will have to make new tabs for this. The RH lower bar can't go on right now because I need to cut off my brace and put another on so I can get the suspension bracket on. This is just mocking up trying to get an idea and make sure everything is correct. There seems to be so many diferent opinions on which angles for which bars work the best. It can be very difficult to wade through it. My buddy has a very good suspension book and I have been reading the sections on it about triangulated rear suspensions and I think I've got it figured out now.

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Well it's looking great from here! :D

I wasn't around while you were working on it last week but I would've also suggested getting more air under the frame. So I was glad to read that you already made that decision.:D

Yeah, I decided that once it's set, going up will be harder than adjusting for a lower ride height.

You are going to raise the upper left bar at the rear so the end is level with housing?????

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Originally Posted by jerry clayton

You are going to raise the upper left bar at the rear so the end is level with housing?????

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Jerry, with the way it was in the pics, I'd have to raise the mount on the H side of the center of the rear end so it would be the same height as the LH mount. I can't put the mounts in the same spot of the housing due to the offset in the housing for the carrier center section.


I didn't get anything major done on it this weekend. I purchased a straight truck box for storage, so work on the 40 is on a stand still for now. I'm picking up the pieces and putting it in storage for now. I have some out side work I need to get done and I'm hoping to add another bay on before the white stuff flies. Then work on the 40 can start back up.

I haven't made any progress on the car. But I did move the frame on Sunday, and I figured I need to start pricing things to rebuild the engine. That led me to re-evaluating my entire game plan. Every fall for the past 2 at least, I've been saying, "I'll get the car done enough to drive by summer." Every winter I buy parts and things come up. Well, this spring we are going to start the first house buying process. I have a big plan to get all the vehicles I have mobile on their own before this if possible. I've been buying all the fancy things I think my 72 needs and now I've came to a realization. If I continue dumping boat loads of cash in the 72, nothing else will et done. Right now, my mind set is to forget puting turbos on the 40. I won't rebuild the engine this year. I'll reseal it and put the oil system parts it needs to run the new filter set up, get an aluminum intake, and just get what it needs to run and drive. It's still a big list, but nearly as bad with a hemi rebuild. That will save $3000 minimum for now. I can concentrate on that if an issue arises in the engine, or I just do it. Well, there is the grand plan today. We'll see how it plays out. Haha

Ryan, I agree with you on getting the Hemi in and just running. The effort you use on getting it mounted, body back on frame, and it running is not a duplicate of effort if you elect to rebuild the motor. It sure is inspiring if you can just drive the car around some and get that good old hot rod feeling back in your shoes. Go for it, you can always make more power. If you do, you will also have a good solid car to compare the power change and output to. Rooting for you!

Thanks sir. A few of my buddies are trying to get me to just cram an LS in it. For the cost it is intriguing. But, I have all this invested in the Hemi. And the Hemi trumps an LS in cool factor. :LOL:

Not that it matters but I agree with your decisions. Getting the car driveable will be a milestone in itself after all the frame fixing that you've already done. And then there's the corvette and I think you had 2 or 3 other projects going on at the same time.?.?.?

Simple and achievable will work bet for now. imho.. 8-)

Yeah, there are a bunch of projects going on. That doesn't help. Someday maybe I can control that? I don't know. This winter I want to concentrate on the 72, and 40. I was going to build a 72 Suburban for a DD but I think that may wait. I will at some point do some body work to the 95 and it will be my DD hopefully sooner than later.

Yep. Like you I found myself with a bunch of work.. for me it was for many different friends and family and then the job. I actually "lost" the whole summer to work!

I found myself totally burnt out and went to hide out with Mr. Spears in the Midwest. I've shed most of the tasks and only 2 or 3 left. So getting back onto my coupe
will become a priority again. I've only driven it abut 6 or 7 miles I think in all of 2014. To me that is sad.

Apparently I made a mistake in telling my wife how I had to get my chop saw to work. She was out at the shop about a month ago and saw me start it. She asked why I had to do that and I told her it was worn out. It probably needed new brushes. Sometimes it wouldn't spin, but if you just brushed the disc it would start. So, to make a long story short, my parent's had my name this year for Christmas, and got me a new chop saw! Hopefully this one cuts a little straighter than my old one.

OOOOOOOOOooo... NICE! :)

I've never tried one of those.. not sure why. Just haven't. I usually go for my sawzall.

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40 I think Jerry Clayton was referring to the alignment of the links ,, this will produce a counter twist . They need to be parallel to each other . You can cut taller mounts and place them 90 degrees to the housing . You are doing some great frame strengthening ,, they helped me so much here on my A frame .


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Bobby, those were just sat there for a quick mock up. I have to make new upper mounts for them to be in the correct position. I just wanted to get an idea how bad things were going to be.

Don't get excited, no progress on this one. Haha

But, the other day my wife was on the phone with my mother. Mom asked my wife if I had anyone coming to look at any parts, and I didn't. She said she'd call us back. Well come to find out, it was a brother of the guy whom owned my 40 before my uncle. He told my mom he had lost track of it after it was sold from the guy I purchased it from. I guess the man would like to see it again before he leaves this world. My mom told him he could see parts of it because it's torn apart to be fixed. :LOL: He asked when it'd be back together and of course she had no idea. He didn't leave a number, he just said he'd come back. Maybe I'll get it together for next year and the guy will still be around? We shall see.

Now that we've been in the house for a little bit, I've been doing a project over view future plan. With that said, I've taken into consideration what extra money I really have after bills, kid stuff, fun stuff for kids, and home up keep. It really shed light that if I want to get the 40 driving by next spring, I need to make some changes. Or sell something. Seeing how there isn't a great favorable market for projects from the sellers perspective, I came up with a plan B.

Plan B

I think the best thing for me to do at the present time is to leave the 354 in storage and get a Model A coupe and build the ride I've always wanted later down the road. I was going to take the chance and just re-seal the Hemi and run it the way it is, but I think that is a dumb idea. :LOL: Something tells me that a ring will break, or who knows since the engine has been sitting for years. Granted, it has been started and ran, but not ran long enough to put any miles on it. I put a price list together of everything needed to give the hemi a mild rebuild. It came to $3600 before machine work. I'll have near $1000 in machine work after that too. I'm thinking I'll have about $3500 extra to put into the car before spring. The Hemi will eat all the funds and that will leave a car still in half a million pieces.

That brings us to Plan B. I'm going to put a 350 and TH350 in it. No, no, just kidding. :) I forgot I have a 351c sitting in a shed. The plan is to rebuild it, mild cam, aussie 2v heads, performer rpm air gap intake, aod trans, and vintage air. It won't have the cool factor of the hemi, but the car won't be setting torn apart doing nothing either. We'll see how the plan comes together or changes.

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Originally Posted by 40FordDeluxe

Now that we've been in the house for a little bit, I've been doing a project over view future plan. With that said, I've taken into consideration what extra money I really have after bills, kid stuff, fun stuff for kids, and home up keep. It really shed light that if I want to get the 40 driving by next spring, I need to make some changes. Or sell something. Seeing how there isn't a great favorable market for projects from the sellers perspective, I came up with a plan B.

Plan B

I think the best thing for me to do at the present time is to leave the 354 in storage and get a Model A coupe and build the ride I've always wanted later down the road. I was going to take the chance and just re-seal the Hemi and run it the way it is, but I think that is a dumb idea. :LOL: Something tells me that a ring will break, or who knows since the engine has been sitting for years. Granted, it has been started and ran, but not ran long enough to put any miles on it. I put a price list together of everything needed to give the hemi a mild rebuild. It came to $3600 before machine work. I'll have near $1000 in machine work after that too. I'm thinking I'll have about $3500 extra to put into the car before spring. The Hemi will eat all the funds and that will leave a car still in half a million pieces.

That brings us to Plan B. I'm going to put a 350 and TH350 in it. No, no, just kidding. :) I forgot I have a 351c sitting in a shed. The plan is to rebuild it, mild cam, aussie 2v heads, performer rpm air gap intake, aod trans, and vintage air. It won't have the cool factor of the hemi, but the car won't be setting torn apart doing nothing either. We'll see how the plan comes together or changes.

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LOL... Oh how many times have I had the exact thought over the last 45 years! LOL Obviously I still have my very first car that burned to the ground in 1974. My model A... Some day, you watch some day! I think I need to keep that one project in the back burner just incase I run out of projects. LOL You know which plan Id go with. Man-O-Man, Life Gets In the Way of Everything!

I got side tracked on my 47 travel trailer again. As soon as summer is over Im going to off it and finish up a few of my old outstanding projects as well. Hang in there Ryan this too will pass my friend...

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They still havent fixed the picture thing here? WoW

Seems like Ryan makes some compromises on a project and M.T. comes out of the woodwork!:eek::eek::LOL::LOL::p:LOL::LOL:


Don't worry Ryan.. it'll get better! :rolleyes::p:rolleyes::p:rolleyes:

Hey, just because Im not talking doesnt mean Im not watching! I see you guys all talking about how the forum is getting slow and everything but when you have a life changing / serious decision like our friend Ryan is going through I think GOOD SOLID advice is needed... Im back in the saddle!!!! :LOL: Geeeze ;) I mean this is serious stuff right here!

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Originally Posted by 34_40

Seems like Ryan makes some compromises on a project and M.T. comes out of the woodwork!:eek::eek::LOL::LOL::p:LOL::LOL:

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Oh, was that M.T.? I saw the dig about picture posting, and assumed it was Jerry;):LOL::LOL::LOL:

:**):LOL: Oh that's is really rich right there! Nothing changes with us old cuss'es does it. Is Jerry still here? OMG who would of guessed that? :LOL:**): Sorry for the distraction Ryan... Back on topic!

Nice to see you back on here MT! Aka Tri Bob! :LOL: This is a serious predicament. I have to spend the few extra green backs I make in the right places. Haha I've been saying it for 3 years, but I really want to drive this thing next year. (For real)

You had me sold on it with the 350/350.....

Well I tend to be pretty old school when dealing with this kinda of stuff. Id make it roll the eaisest least expensive way possible. If ya fall in love with it... sweet if ya brake a ring slap a hone job in it and put it back together and drive it some more. At least with it rolling in any shape you can move it if needed. Id put that Hemi in deep storage and save it for a Model A some day. What ever that is worth?

I have thought about rolling the dice on the hemi. Geeze Bob! Haha One of my friends keeps telling me to just hone it, put new rings and bearings in it, and run with it. He keeps saying the 280hp it had stock is probably more than the car has had in a while. And tell sme to live with it. Haha I know the 377 in it was not 280hp for sure.

Are you going to have oil pan clearance problems using the Ford engine? As I recall it uses a front sump and the 354 (and SBC you pulled) both use a rear sump.

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I agree with tri-Bob... fwiw.

get it together and drive it. You can always re-do it later 'cause we all know a hot rod is never truly done 'til you sell it..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mike P

Are you going to have oil pan clearance problems using the Ford engine? As I recall it uses a front sump and the 354 (and SBC you pulled) both use a rear sump.

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You're correct. the 351C is a front sump. But one of my friends says there is a stock rear sump pan available. The more I think about it the more I'm undecided. :LOL: I may just use the 354 because I have a lot of the trinkets to put it in. Like a couple of you have said, if it does puke it's guts, I could just re-ring it/fix it when it happens. At least the car would be together then.

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Originally Posted by rspears

Oh, was that M.T.? I saw the dig about picture posting, and assumed it was Jerry;):LOL::LOL::LOL:

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The pictures are the only things I don't have issues with on this site. It's posting a comment ot getting on that are the biggest aggravation lately.

It's the thrill of working through all the obstacle and making it all work so one can actually and eventually get to a point where one can actually post up. Its a crap shoot for sure. It reminds me of the Olympics motto. The thrill of victory or the agony of defeat. But I aint complaining cause this is the way it has always been and I keep coming back! :LOL: Its all good from my view point! Hang tuff buddy and listen to that small voice in your heart. It will lead you to the right decision. :cool: