Just wanted to see what everyone used for painting their chassis.
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Just wanted to see what everyone used for painting their chassis.
Had mine powder coated
I usually use single stage with a good hardener. Quite durable yet easy to touch up all the rock chips and stuff a frame gets.... I've also done frames with BC/CC, really makes a good lookin' frame!
I`ve heard a lot of people using John Deere blitze black, durable...
X 2 Powdercoat
Fter using it on mine, I really like the por-15. Nut you have to do all 3 steps and don't get it on your hands, takes forever to get off
We're painting them less and less. Powdercoating is just so much easier, you drop the parts off and a week later you pick them up all done. The cost is very close by the time you factor in all the stuff you use to do the job, not to mention the time involved. On some where the frame shows and needs a lot of filler though sometimes painting still has some advantages, although you can fill and sand a frame using something like Tiger Drylac if you don't mind the tough sanding job and expense.
Don
I'll offer my snow belt comment again. If you live in an area where snow/ice melt chemicals are used and you ever intend to drive in the winter when roads may be treated you may want to think hard before using powder coating. It is a thin film with very little flex, and if you get any flaw like a rock chip, scratch, gap at a inside corner, etc, that lets moisture in your frame will rust beneath the coating and you may not know it until the damage is extensive. It is interesting (to me) that everyone high on powder coating is in a sun belt area with little or no snow threat.
I use eastwoods spray chassis black . Have also used brush applied. I think the blitz black is to dull for the frame. .But then I'm kinda the same way:LOL:
I heard por-15 is tough to work with. Did you brush it on or spray it. I have the chassis and suspension that needs to get painted. I feel overwhelmed!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by tudorkeith
My frame was rusty. Por 15 did the trick, it's relatively cheap considering other options, but bonds great to the metal(and your hands!) A pint did my whole frame. If your looking for a professional, show quality , you might consider powder coating or some of the other stuff mentioned above.
What abput the springs and the rest of the suspension?
My frame wasn't all that rusty and no is isn't any tougher to work with. I brushed mine. It's pretty thick. the marine kleen and metal prep worked great. Just wear long sleeves crappy clothes and those thicker yello dish gloves not those thin neoprene blue ones. I did driveshaft, springs but no moving areas obliously. It can take a topcoat if it will see the sun much. I would use it again
Was your frame original or boxed. How much Did you have to buy to coat everything?Quote:
Originally Posted by tudorkeith
mine is clipped, boxed and has a paralell leaf set upI also did the complete underneath of the body and the interior floor and trunk. I bought a qallon kit on ebay for a decent price had 1 left over and we couldn't turn my frame over to paint. If you have it in the budget get a gallon if not probibly can make due with a half. when you brush it on, the brush marks do go away.
I should add I did the differential and leaf springs too. The paint is almost water thin(thus as mentioned wear clothing you don't care about for it drips off the brush easily) but goes on and self levels, thus no brush marks as stated above. If you prep it with the marine clean(in kit) it will bond very well, especially to rusted surfaces. I recently had to grind two spots on the frame for ground wires, and was amazed at how tough the stuff was to get off. Started with sand paper, ended with electric grinder! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by KOULAIDE
I also went out and looked at the can it's a quart, not pint sorry for misinfo, but point is it goes a long way!
I was asked this question the other day regarding work I used to do on commerical trucks and tractor trucks; we would always( on all over paint jobs at least paint the chassis, just to make the job look better, we used a cheap acrylic enamel, but thinned it with laquer thinner and used a fast 2k hardener. It wasnt super shiny, but dried really fast and the hardener gave ti some durability. It's a cheap and easy fix for a car that getsd driven a lot...tho you're probly looking for a better looking or more durable fix I thought it was worth sharing in case anyone could use it!
PPG has a super hard, good flowing, high gloss industrial coating that works great, too.....
For street cars, I've also been quite pleased with Ace Hardware's Rust preventitive paint, and acrylic enamel, mixed the same way NC mentioned in the post above.... It becomes very, very durable. Did the bottom of my '71 Ford Pick-em-up with it, the stuff is slow curing but when cured it is quite hard and excellent chip resistance.... (and cheap, the Ace paint is about $8.00 a quart)
Just as an afterthought; I tried a trick from an oldtimer down the road( a diesel mechanic who rebuiklds tractors and old farm trucks for fun) along Daves lines, I painted the floorpan of my VW using plain FlatBlack Rustoleum ,in the quart can, thinned as per the directions but with just a capful of hardener( I used generic enamel medium hardener) it dried about the same as usual, kinda slow, but the hardener gave it kind of an eggshll finish and was pretty hard! i dont know how it lasted since I sold the car right after, but mite be worth experimenting with since the paint can be had easily and cheaply!Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Severson
I used the Extreme satin chassis black from Eastwood. It looks good and wears well too.
I have to go with powder coat. The frame has to be blasted to white steel including places that you can't sand clean, then the pc applied. This stuff gets into nooks and crannies that paint wont flow except by gravity:HMMM:. The other ways are pretty good as well, but not as tough as a good PC job. Will it ding - probably, but for sure not as easily as paint. I've dropped tools and other body parts on mine with no more then a surface scratch, Is it as cheap as paint - IMO, yes, by the time you get done doing the many, many hours of surface prep - in other words, how much is your time worth. My chassis was done in about 10 days by a very large operation doing mostly race car chassis and it included a bunch of frame brackets - price wise, less then $500, but this was a 'bargain' vs the $6-800 quoted by others and the figure I would consider normal.
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i8...afterpcoat.jpg
Also, look at this current thread - this too was done the same place as mine:http://www.clubhotrod.com/forums/sho...threadid=42663
I am at a decision point with my frame & components primed, doing minor fill and prep before final paint. I'm having a hard time deciding between 1) single stage black, 2) single stage black with 50% clear mixed in on the final coat, or 3) base coat black with clear coat. My paint guy says that repairs to BC/CC are easier, since it is often just a clear coat repair while rock chips to single stage are to primer; but that doing the hybrid mix is a good compromise - the pigment tends to migrate to the bottom of that layer, leaving a clear protecting layer that is more repair friendly. He would really like to see me single stage the paint, then put on a final coat of ArmorCoat http://armorcoatusa.com/ but $150 for a sprayable quart is pretty expensive even though I do live a mile back on gravel.... This is on a highboy, so the frame and body paint need to match, which rules out specialty chassis paints. Any thoughts?
I would respectfully disagreeQuote:
Originally Posted by rspears
The main benefit to powder coating is that it is applied at a higher film build than paint typically, on frames we usually apply between 3-5 mils. paint is usually considerably thinner than that.
The main advantage to powder coat vs most paints is it's flexibility.
I have on many occasion bent test panels past 90* befor any type of de lamination begins. most paints will not do this... not even close
No matter the coating, once the coating is scratched to the substrate, the potential for rust and corrosion to begin is greatly increased.
I live in the snow belt, exposed to the chems, and conditions you speak of, and am personally happy with the results I have with powder coated parts.
I must also say there is always more than one way to skin a cat.... or build a car. We all do what we know is the best for our cars, and budget.
I also realize that powder coat is not for everyone, I figured since it's what I do I would try to dispel a few myths
Respectfully
Josh
We've begun to have more and more parts powder coated vs painting them ourselves, even tiny ones that are hidden. For one thing, it is so much more convenient.......by the time you drag out the paint equipment, shoot it, then have to clean the gun and left overs, it is a real pain. Secondly, I think it is just as cheap to have them coated by the time you factor in primer, paint, reducers, lacquer thinner for cleanup, etc. With powder coating we just drop the parts off and a couple weeks later pick up a nice part that was sandblasted first, and is now all done.
I had a bunch of parts powder coated this time around on my 27 rebuild, and they are much easier to wipe down than the frame, which I sprayed black.
Don
Josh,
I attempted to tag onto an old thread with a new question about paint choices, which did not work, but I got my answer at the paint shop so no need to repost in a new thread.
My bad powder coating experience is with parts that come powder coated from the supplier, like skid plates for the underside of the Jeep, aftermarket rock bumpers, rocker skids, tire carrier, etc, and not with custom powder coating of raw parts. This may be a big difference, in that preparation and application are critical with any coating. I have had very bad experiences with factory powder, to the point that I peeled it off in sheets with heavy rust beneath on my gas tank skid, and since it does not bubble up like paint, you could not see that there was any rust problem on the surface. In fact, I don't believe that I have had any factory coating hold up for more than a year. Both my front and back bumpers (five years old) have started rusting at the weld joints where parts meet at sharp angles, and I have attacked those places with satin black Rustoleum in an effort to seal the flaws. Again, these are factory coatings as opposed to custom applications. If a custom application solves these problems I would be interested in knowing in enough detail to build some confidence in the coating for harsh environments.
most production shops are looking to give a 1yr type of product.
I redo a ton of powder coating from 2 off road manufactures after 1-2 years
typically only chemically pre treating parts, which werkz well... same as anything else if done properly. Most vehicles on the road today for the past 10-15 years have been chemically pretreated, and it shows. factory paint jobs last longer than pre mid 90's.
chemically pretreated parts done wrong, or poorly (worse than wrong) are the same as no pretreatment. In some cases worse because a coater could easily poorly pre treat a product, have the item rusting almost immediately as a result, then coat over the rust.
Which sounds similar to what you are/were experiencing.
The best results I know of currently is for a part to be mechanically abraded, preferably media blasted, the Phosphate coated, sealed then the finish applied. This werkz with paint or powder.
Once the substrate is properly pretreated to accept a coating, it is then a matter of the actual coating performance. If one has 2 identical parts, pretreated the same exact way, no variance what so ever, except coating. Powder out performs most wet paints in durability, and cost. Usually I can powder coat say a car frame for the same cost as quality paint materials.
then the benefit is client "X" had their frame blasted, pretreated, and coated for $500-$700. Where blasting, pretreatment if one can get it, and then quality paint supplies would easily cost the same, then customer "X" would either have to apply the paint, or pay someone labor.
Like I said, I'm not saying powder is the best thing in the world, or is for every application. It is usually a superior product when applied properly. I hate to hear about instances when it hasn't been, and fails prematurely.
Sharp edges always cause edge pull, paint or powder, and weld seams are usually moving joints on bumpers. Blasting, and lightly filing the sharp edges usually cures those issues. for a manufacture it's an extra cost, and some company's don't care if it last one day past the warranty sadly
Don i'm not a fan of powder coat, my mate who is a powder coater advises against coating a chassis because it can rust behind and creep underneath.
I've always used basecoat and clear and it lasts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Itoldyouso
Rust can creep from under any coating, not just powder coat.
But if the metal is epoxy primed correctly its highly less likely. epoxy primer is used to prime oil rigs, they don't powder coat :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by STREETWERKZ
Maybe it's because they won't fit in the oven :LOL::LOL:Quote:
Originally Posted by roadster32
I'm with you Roadster! Epoxy primer applied correctly has never let me down!!! Think I'll be sticking with it and bc/cc on my stuff.Quote:
Originally Posted by roadster32
I'm with Dave on this 1
I Epoxy Primed my Frame and Powder Coated all of the suspension pieces-the reason? I was concerned that I might have to change something (exhaust mounts, or Weld something?) down the road-
Dave you can also do virtually anything you like with it, small chassis mods are easy and blow in the paint is simple.
Interesting thing about epoxy primer is that my 56 F100 was epoxy primed and after 90,000 miles i did indeed have some stonechips on the floor underneath, all had chipped down to the epoxy but not one had chipped the epoxy primer itself !!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Severson
I agree, a good epoxy primer will add to durability.
We all have our own ways of doing things, I'm not saying that anyone in this conversation is wrong.
Just adding my limited experience, and flavor to the conversation also:D
I did these semi fuel tanks, steps, air tanks, air filter housing, headlights, rear fender, mirror brackets, etc 3 years, and almost 600,000 miles ago... and they have held up just fine. This vehicle goes from Ohio, to CA, to TX, back to OH, so it see's just about every type of weather and road condition out there, he runs year round also (as you can tell by the grime on the truck it gets werked
The case I am making is that powder applied properly is a very durable, and long lasting finish to add to almost any substrate.
there is also epoxy primer in powder coat
unintentional hijack off, sorry:o
i use bc/cc on all our cars .
I tried to attach a picture 'way back' on Post 21 and it didn't show.
This is my chassis a couple weeks after it was powder coated:
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i8...mplchassis.jpg
Would epoxy+BC/CC been as good? Possibly(probably) - except for the fact the powder coaters were able to grit blast places I could never reach and the PC is inside of the boxed frame as well. And I've never had the skills necessary to shoot paint around corners plus nooks and crannies behind brackets:eek::LOL:.
everything is better with cool whip on it isn't it? :LOL:Quote:
Originally Posted by IC2
hard to find a better product than POR-15. can be sprayed or brushed. very durable and good looking. also, spraying will make a little go a loooong way
It sure is easier Don but if it does start peeling its a bitch to get off again, probably something to do with climate but powder coating on frames does't seem to do well here in england, I much prefer Epoxy primer and 2K topcoat. Its always served me well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Itoldyouso