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Well today, I got off my a$$ and started to remove the engine. Many hours later it is still connected to tranny via the torque converter I'm guessing. It took longer than I thought to disconnect everything. With Dennys help and only two thread highjacks:( sorry guys!, ) I got to the point of the motormounts free, the tranny unbolted from the engine, and the cherry picker hooked up. The immediate problems include the steering bar under the truck runs so low it hits the arm(legs) of the cherry picker, so I had to jack the truck up to clear the legs of the hoist, to get the hoist over the engine. Next, the tranny was so fond of being attached to this engine it wouldn't let go. I was doing this all solo*(although Pretzel tried to help) so my frustration factor was high. I decided to stop for the day and post where I'm at. I think I might bolt the tranny back on and pull the whole power train altogether, then separate them once out of the truck. I'm worried that I might not clear the hood front with the truck jacked up, so we'll see. I also figured out why the engine is in at a 9 dgree angle see photos below. The crank pulley sits right above a frame cross member, by about 1/4 inch, so he could drop it any lower without removing that. I know these engines will fit into this truck, because CPP sells a motor mount for a 460 for the 48 F1 truck that bolts in, I think the engine just needs to go further back! So I'll order that and see how the engine sits with it in. I'd like to get the engine out without the tranny, but can't seem to get the torque converter off the fly wheel(maybe the engine angle affects that too. Advice, thoughts?
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...vens/001-4.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...tovens/009.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...tovens/012.jpg
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I do think you will be happier if you can move the engine back a few inches to drop into the space behind that crossmember.
Dumb question on your engine not coming out situation. You did remove the torque converter to flexplate bolts, didn't you? If so, like Denny said, you might just have things cocked in there and the locating pins are keeping the transmission to be stuck on the block.
Little different than those nice, light small block Chevy engines, huh?? :LOL: :LOL:
Don
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Yeah! I took the 4 nuts off the torque converter from the fly wheel, but couldn't get it to slide back. I'll try playing with jacking the tranny and engine together. I might have to wait for help later in the week if that doesn't work! Good thing I bought the lift, just think 5 days rental would be what I already paid!:D
Boy I'm stiff and sore now! I think for every step foward the truck takes a few blows back in the form of punishment to my body! Maybe I'll name it Christine!:D
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My neighbor showed up in town today, so tomorrow we'll try to get the beast out! Meanwhile on Dave's and Don's and a few other of you guy's advice I've been hunting around about rebuild kits and rebuilt engines. I think I found the solution today from a place called S & S in Spokane, Wa. They sell rebuilt engines to your specs for very reasonable prices with pretty good warrentees. The parts are all new and name brand. I talked with a guy there, told him what I have and what I want, and this is the quote he gave me:
Engine cost 1485.00
Core charge 200.00
Cloy's Double row timing set 50.00
Series 2 street performance cam 50.00
shipping 175.00 to my door, fork lift free.= 1960.00 total.
This long block comes with the block, heads, and all the internals. The only thing you will need is the external covers. Such as oil pan, valves covers, intake. Ect...
The engine also includes a complete set of Felpro gaskets and a new Melling oil pump, as well as an unbeatable warranty.
The engine comes with a 7 year 70,000 mile warranty. We cover parts and labor for the full 7 years. The standard labor rate that applies with this warranty is 50.00 per hour up to a max of 850.00 (This warranty also applies for self installation). The only thing that changes for self installation is the amount of labor we cover. For self installation we cover 15.00 a hour. We do however offer a Premium Warranty that will cover 85.00 per hour up to a max of 1200.00. The Premium warranty is a additional 350.00.( This warranty is for ASE certified installation only.)
This engine is built with premium pro stock aftermarket parts, they are as fallows. The pistons used are Federal Mogul or Sealed Power(in my case, flat top hypereutectic pistons), Rings are Hastings, new Durabond hardened seats, Cloy's steel timing set, Elgin stainless steel valves, springs, keepers, retainers, rockers, push rods, lifters, nuts, fulcrums, and cam. The crank is reground and polished, and new Clevite77 over sized bearings are used. The blocks are baked, shotpeened, and magnafluxed Then the blocks are bored, and diamond honed. This same process is used on our cylinder heads.
Casey Fulks
S & S Engine Manufacturing Company
1023 N. Monroe Street
Spokane Washington 99201
I don't think I'll be able to beat this, plus, I'm pretty sure I can sell my existing engine on craigslist for 3-400.00 bucks since it runs! Chime in!
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I take it that is a 460 you are talking about, Steve? If so, that seems like a good price to me. BBF are not cheap to rebuild, and if these guys have a good reputation you should be ok.
We'll see what some of our engine guys on here think.
Don
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That's what I thought. I asked the guy, if he could match my dove-c heads and he said yes. He also sounded honest. They've been in buisness for 38 years, and have direct purchasing on parts, for cheaper prices.
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Well we got the engine out today, suffice to say I missed a bolt that was hidden behing the transmission filler tube. After an explosive moment, luckily nobody was hurt, it broke free taking a block tab with it!:eek: Picture says it all. Truck sits up a bit higher now.
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...ns/engine4.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...ns/engine3.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...tovens/008.jpg
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It's funny, when my neighbor helped me get the engine out the other day, I told him we might as well pull the tranny out at the same time. So I disconnected the linkage, but couldn't get at the bolts that hold it to the cross member. Closer inspection has revealed why. I guess that put it in there could figure how to get at the bolts either so he bolted the bracket to two tabs, dropped it in place and welded the tabs to the cross member. Fortunately I've ordered two new cross members, one for the motor mounts and one for the transmission, so this hopefully won't happen again. the engine was also hard mounted without motormount rubber, so I've got those on order two. I hope it all fits like the CPP pages say it should, with their aftermarket mounts. I've run into a lot of info about 429/460's for trucks only and for cars only. Any idea what is different about them. I noticed if I drop my engine down more, past the front cross member, I'll have problems with the alternator hitting a side brace. I've seen some aftermarket billet alternator mounts that relocate it to the passenger side cylinder head are and bolt it to one of the water pump holes. As I'm selling the old engine, I'm wondering about keeping the old pulleys or buying a new set. I like the March Performance ones, but would just like a replacement set with the right diameters. It seems you either get a different size water pump pulley that increases your water flow, or you get a different size alternator pulley that drops the revolutions to the alternator, to increase horsepower. Since I have a new weiand aluminum water pump that is high flow, it doesn't make sense to go that dirrection. And I have no idea what my electrical requirements will be, but I have a new 100 amp one lead alternator from summit for electrical needs. I'd really just like to find a set that works with the alternator in the higher position, using one v belt to run all three pulleys(waterpump, crank, and alternator) Any suggestions, billet or chrome would be nice, but steel works too. Steve.:D
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Pulled the tranny today. Looks good, other than dirty. I talked to a friend who is our mechanic and who races dirt track cars locally as to where to take the tranny to check it out. He told me the exact same place I had narrowed down locally, which made me feel good. He also gave me a guy's name there who has worked with Randy quite a bit. I feel a lot better about this after talking to Randy. He says the c6 is pretty bullet proof so I feel good about sticking with it. The transmission place charges 100 bucks to break it down and assemble a list of parts and labor to fix it up. They warrenty it for three years or 30k so sounds good to me! I'm always weary of trying a new place out. Takes an elimate of trust, especially where big bucks are concerned. Also want to thank whoever posted the hot rod girl parts place online, I got an 8 ball shifter knob, very cool! If anybody has info towards the pulleys in my last post please chime in, thanks, Steve.:D
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any suggestions on firewall paint. Brands, types, etc.Thanks.:)
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Took the tranny down to the shop today. Got a call this afternoon, that it needs to be rebuilt. Major wear to all internals, but rebuildable. $1100.00. So much for my engine fund, it will take a few months savings to be able to order that. In the meantime they will remanufacture the transmission and give it a three year 30k mile warrenty. I'm glad I decided to do this. It's costly, but what in this hobby isn' t? It was such a fun little project beefing the 429 out, that I figure do it right, do it once, and be confident in the quality you'll have in the power train in the end! No worries while driving it if it'll explode, throw a rod, etc... I guess I'm just a bit slow compared to some of you folks on getting it roadworthy. I guess thats what makes it worth while doing. It will be my truck now once it's done!:3dSMILE:
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Well I got a few hours in on the truck today. First I degreased and then soaped down, followed by pressure washing the front frame, engine bay , leaf springs,etc. Then after leting it dry, I pulled out my small test can of por 15 and painted the leaf springs, most of the front end frame and steering box. That stuff goes along way! It paints on so easily I was suprised. It also looks great as it drys and flatens out. I also primed the whole engine bay. I sprayed on pretty thick, because there were lots of imperfections. I'll go over it with a good sanding on my next day off, and then paint it. It's amazing how such a little thing makes the truck look so much farther along, and so much cleaner. If anyone is considering painting there frame, I highly recogmend the POR 15 paint!:D
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I thought I'd post some preliminary Por 15 photos. Mind you I missed lots of spots and so you can see what it looked like before and after, I need to buy more paint to finish the frame.
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...s/frame001.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...s/frame002.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...s/frame003.jpg
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That's cleaning up pretty well Steve. Without that monster 460 in there you can hold a dance in the engine room. :D
Don
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Thanks Don. Yeah there is a lot of room, funny what no engine does!
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Did some minor sanding and priming and painting today of the firewall and engine bay. I really like the finish the SEM trim black gives. It hides my mistake pretty well, and is a spray can. One can did the job, but, I'll get a second one just to give it a few more coats. I know it's not show car quality, but I'm happy with it!
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...irewall001.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...irewall003.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...irewall005.jpg:whacked:
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Went out and got a second can of SEM Trim Black. After a couple of touchup coats, here is the finished product. Pretzel of course wanted to help! The rust areas you can see still haven't been done. I have to crwl under the truck next to start on that stuff and the rest of the frame. I also am looking for a used air compressor to power my cutoff tool, so I can get rid of the old motor mts. and transmission cross member. I have new stuff to replace it, once it's out!:D
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...rewall2005.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...rewall2006.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...rewall2007.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...rewall2009.jpg
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Well I scored big time on ebay this week. I've been biding time watching grills for the f1 as mine has some dented bars. A perfect condition one showed up that was poorly listed as a 52, and no reference to either ford or f1(one or the other), so the usual profiteers who buy them for upwards of 230, didn't join the bidding war, so for 103 bucks, plus 40 shipping, I got a basicaly new grill!:) The best part is I probably can sell my existing grill for this locally! I also got a piece of front end that goes behind the bumper to form the middle of the front of the truck, and also under the radiator, where mine is completely rusted out, for 15 bucks and 12 shipping. Now I'll I need is running boards and the body with be close to perfect. My wife also gave me the go ahead for the new 26 gallon porter cable air compressor, so the rest of the summer should go well with rust removal and body prep!
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Good scores, way to go.:3dSMILE:
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Yesterday was a good day, but little to show for the work involved.
I was able to cut off the old motor mounts. Man what a pain. Who ever put them in there did a great job! The welds were very solid! It took two trips to the local hardware store, three sawzall blades and some parts for the new 30 gallon compressor to get them off. I've never used the cutoff tool for so long before, have to remember to get some good ear plugs to avoid perminent hearing damage. Its funny because the way the mounts were welded consisted of three welds per bracket to the frame, some in places you couldn't get to without working backwards cutting apart the brackets. So 3 hours and 30 dollars later here is my end results. The passenger side frame member got a slice in it, but that'll be a great spot to practice welding with the new mig welder, when it arrives next week. I did get the hang of grinding the old welds off as well. Note to self, shorts, tee shirt and birkenstocks not conssidered safety clothing! Ouch! Here are some photos, plus one of Pretzel and the new girl looking goofy together!
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...ndframe012.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...ndframe010.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...ndframe003.jpg
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We gotta have a caption contest for that one! :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: :LOL:
Don
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How about a little tongue there baby..........Not with that bad breath you don't..........LOL
Is that good enough caption.
BradC
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Pretty good Brad. I posted a post just for these comments. On the truck note, my new Hobart 140 mig welder arrived. I went down to our local welding supply to see about a cart and gas tank. I bought a cart from him to support local business and probably will get the gas cylinder from him too. His prices are a little steep, but lets face it he's local, and he's gotta make a living too, his advice is invaluable. Plus I'll be going there when I run out of stuff and to get tanks refilled. He's a fellow hot rodder whose been doing this stuff since the fifties(though he looks too young to have been around in the 50's! He highly recommends 75/25 Argon /Co2 mixture. Says it cools the metal to where I won't be as likely to warp the sheet metal. I asked about just using flux core but he thought that would be too hot for car sheet metal. His tanks are 160 new, with the gas fill for free on new tanks for the first fill. I've seen them as cheap as 89 on the internet, but by time you throw in shipping, tax and gas it's not too much savings compared to just buying localy. What are your opinions about the temperature thing for welding sheet metal? I just want to patch some small holes in the running boards and repair the rear window frame seem that attaches to the roof. I know Don likes the gas to reduce spatter, but what about temp?**)
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I took the bed off the truck today by myself. Really was quite easy. 4 bolts, the use of a creeper for a second set of hands, and there you go. I pressure washed the frame to prep for painting it, and was supprised to see what good shape it was in under the bed of the truck. here are a few photos.
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c.../bedoff001.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c.../bedoff009.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c.../bedoff010.jpg
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After I was done cleaning it, I had to laugh. It looks like pieces of the truck were flying off as it moved foward!
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c.../bedoff036.jpg
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Here is a piece of sheet metal I found buried in the bed of the truck. If you put it on the side of the truck it is curved to the same angles as the fuel filler hole on the passenger side of the cab. Since I'm planning on an underbed gas tank in the finished truck(not the one pictured, by the way, that covering the old filler hole for the cab will be necessary. I'm thinking of welding the curved sheet metal to the inside of the cab where it will be hidden by the interior liner behind the seat, to use as a backing plate. Then I can weld in a oval piece to match the existing hole, grind it smooth and Bob's your uncle!
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c.../bedoff032.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c.../bedoff010.jpg
I'm also trying to figure out the best aproach to beefing up this seem above the rear window. The interior weld is rusted and crumbling away. I figure I'll grind the rust away and see if I can weld it also from the inside because again it will be hidden from sight, by the head liner.
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c.../bedoff030.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c.../bedoff028.jpg
Since this welding stuff is all new to me I figure I'd ask if this approach makes sense and will work!
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That'll work to clean out the weld on the inside, a cut off wheel will get in a bit deeper to clean the rust out, and with light pressure it won't cut through.... Also, might want to give some thought to cleaning out the weld on the outside, the stitch weld it closed and have a filled seam...... Welded all of the seams on my '71, really smooth out the looks of the truck....
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Dave when yoy say stitch welding, do you mean welding the entire seam solid, or stitching in welds along the seam, and then body filing the gaps? Not sure, thought I'd ask.
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Well, not sure stitch is the technical term, just what I use.... I start with a tack about every two inches along the seam, let everything cool on it's own, then add another tack and keep going in that manner til the seam is filled completely. If you work at it, get the voltage and wire speed set correctly, doesn't take much to finish the seam off other then a bit of grinding and sanding... Best part is, once the seam is filled it's never again going to serve as a trash and moisture collector!!!! Big thing is getting all the trash, rust, and seam sealer out befor you start welding. It's a long, slow process but when done correctly it won't cause any distortion or warping of the skin.....
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Coming along nice Steve. That thing really has a solid body and frame. :) :)
Don
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Dave that makes sense. Also using the cutoff tool to clean the seam makes sense too. Boy when that thing is whizzing near your ear for 20 minutes it's enough to cause ear damage! I was worried that if I didn't do something to the outside of the seam, that the whole rust process will start all over again. I do like the look oof the seam though. It gives it the old time truck look!
Don thank you. Yep the frame and leaf springs are in alot better shape than I would have guessed. Today I'm going to paint the frame, and work on the cab behind the bed portion. I don't want to leave the bed lying around(just not enough space for everything apart!)
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c.../bedoff004.jpg
It's the new girl and me today, Pretzel got to go to work with my wife!
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...ns/tiva001.jpg
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I got a fair amount of frame painting done with POR15 today. Unfortunately there was a nasty wind blowing that sent little seeds from my neighbors Euculyptis trees all over the tacking paint. I moved the truck back into the barn to finish it, but the fumes started to get pretty bad. So I stopped for the day. The frame and leaf springs came out ok. Here is a few shots:
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...ramebed009.jpg
http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/c...ramebed006.jpg
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Frame is looking good, but the dogs are prettier!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Yeah
They are lucky I don't paint them. I like the Por 15 stuff, but I got glossy in a pint, because the semi gloss only came in quarts at my paint store. It was a little shinny for my taste, so i HIT IT WITH SOME TRIM BLACK i HAD LEFT OVER FROM THE ENGINE BAY. (caps lock, I hate that button) Anyway, I'll crawl under it this weekend and paint every thing I can get at then call it quits on the frame painting and move on to sanding and grinding and welding.(if my welding shield ever arrives in the mail!) But yeah, I'm happy with it, and it is coming along pretty quickly.:D Thanks Dave.
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On our '47 Ford/'89 S-10 we used POR-15 also. Holds on pretty good so far. I was concerned about the note on it not standing up to UV rays, so I got some rattle cans of Rust-O-Leum Hammered Black and sprayed that over the POR. So far it's alright! If we ever get it done and on the road -- we'll see! It's certainly a whole lot better than what we had --- RUST. haahaa. Perley
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Yesterday was filled with skinned nuckles. I was trying to get my old grill off the truck. I think there must be 16-20 bolts, all rusted, holding it on. Some are so strategically located that removing them in certain sequences is the only way to get to the next bolt. After 3 hours, and about 60% of them snapping off , I stopped for the day and worked on the Honey do list, and barbequing a tri-tip!:) The only way I could get a few off was losen them enough to get the sawzall in there enough to bight in.. I had to laugh cleaning up, two air ratchets, 1/2 inch hand rachet, 3/8 " drive hand ratchet, cut off tool, three box end wrenches, 5 different screw drivers, jack stands and lift, sawsall and several balde carcasses, etc... And it is still on tight! I figure this is one of those chip away projects, where you take turns working on it, then move on as it wears you out. I really feal for those Ford assembly line guys 60 years ago. This truck is basically bolted together everywhere. Some of the bolts are in such tight spaces that it would take 30 minutes with two box end wrenches get snug them up!
Now I see why we discuss the price of bolts and other hardware. I'd never consider, ever putting any of the survivors back on the truck!:D
It also makes me fret over the old bolts still in that are holding the cab in place!:eek: One accident an the cab may go flying off like an ejector seat in A James Bond film! :eek: :LOL:
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Well heck, if it was easy and painless everybody would be doing it!!!!!:LOL: :LOL: :LOL:
I don't have a lot of patience with old body bolts....Usually I just drill or cut them out and replace them with a well placed weld or two or three......
My hat is off to someone who actually takes the time to take it apart and put it back together the way the factory intended it be done!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Dave
I actually went out and bought a hack saw blade that has a handle on one end, and the blade is free on the other end, to try and slide it between the panel seams. If that doesn't work I'll try the drill idea, if it'll fit in the tight spaces. I have three left to take out, all with stripped heads, I wish they snapped as easy as the strip!:LOL:
I also got two ratcheting double box end wrenches 9/16"x5/8" and 7/16"x 1/2" as these seem to be a 48 Ford's best friends!:LOL: :D
Wish I had them yesterday! My wife looked at my arms and hands and said OUCH!:CRY:
