Thread: roller rockers?

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I agree that roller tip rockers are not ideal. However, the point I was trying to make Pat, was given the fact he is on a restricted budget, they are a less expensive alternative to getting a true ratio without having to replace all the studs and purchase a set of fully rollerized rocker arms and Poli-Locks.

I know many Folks will say how all the stress is in the Ball area of the Rocker . And Many Engine Guys will stick to that . But as anyone can see by the wear on the Tips of the rockers and top of the valves . There is in fact more friction going on then Folk may want to think of . I have no Problem up Grading to Roller Tip Stamp Rockers when the Price is Right . Also I have used them Comp Rockers and they worked great did not have any Burn up on me . I used a set of Roller Tip Stamped rockers on this 327 Build Elgin Brand not as Heavy Like the Comps but Looked to be good Rockers and Priced well .

With your post about you and your budget I wanted to tell you your in good company here.Many of us got our start just like you and I for one respect you for your working efforts.

I do have a split decision about roller rockers.I do not think they are the biggest bang for your buck,but given your just trying to get alittle more given your budget I well understand that.To follow what Pat is telling you is the best advise you going to get.Don't get discouraged if you can't get the parts as fast as you think you should.Builds and projects do not and should not have a completion date.So my advise is if you find that your going up short for a part you want to get,save more money and be very proud of what you where able to do.

I'll be here in the cheap seats cheering you on and helping where I can.

Well said Gary -

I'll second most of what's been said and encourage you to just listen to Pat and others - digest it a bit and write up a plan for where you'd like to be in say six months. We've all been 17 and really - we do know what you're going through. I for one am impressed with the way you've presented your situation and you're holding your own with your first exchange on the forum.

I'd put what you've got together and use stock rockers arms (if you have them) and run it a while - this will not be the last time you're into the motor and hearing it run and driving the car a bit will be an encouragement. If you don't have the stock rockers, Summit sells a stamped steel 1.5 lift ratio kit for about 90 bucks (Summit Racing SUM-141506) that has roller tips and comes with new balls and nuts so you've got some neat new components in the valve train that will reduce friction and not break your bank.

When I was 17, I was working a 312 Ford with mushroom tappets and had that thing apart "several times" to change cams and such - one time because I got the lash too tight and bent a push rod, another time because I got a "good deal" on a "3/4 race cam" that actually ran like crap because I had the wrong tappets... That's how I (and many others here) learned.

Keep asking questions - we sometimes come across as a bunch of gruff ol' billy goats, but there's a ton of experience here and a lot of wisdom to be had.

Regards,
Glenn

tips wear from lack of lube push rods not really the right length they should be most of the time the tip is going to show wear on a hi mile engine so thats going to happen .there has been hi rent rocker arms for nascar that has no roller on the tip . after saying all this can your prove the tip roller is working all the time ? the ball see s every thing .as for steel stamp rocker last 3 engines i built used them i did mid lift check and checked for max lift they were not has far off as one would think but the quality of the one set was less then stellar there a rash of over sea junk that has darken my life so its hard to say thats good any more .any thing that was is no more . the fun life of a engine builder

Ok I have not opened many Hot Rod Books for some time now Ha-Ha . But I did remember David Vizard talked about this in one of his many H.P Book's .

Here are his thoughts ( The operating tip of roller rocker rolls across the tip of the valve , side loading on the valvestem is dramatically reduced, this increases stem and guide life . and since high valve lift can greatly increase side load and wear , especially if you use stamped-steel , stud mounted rockers )

Ok I would go by what He said . My thoughts / 2 Cents any one can see a round rolling part will have less friction then a Flat part rubbing up and down and walking on another Flat part . They get enough oil I have taking Roller Tip Rockers off with over 100K miles that had no wear on the Roller Tips and the Valves come right out of the Head's you Don't have to file them first .

well over the years thing change ls1 engines and fords other s use trunnions with out roller tip s and the tip is not flat if you re arc stock rockers you would know that . they can make more power stock then any old sbc stock chevy with roller tips. the tip could come in to play with more spring psi and lift . but then this is a very small lift cam . you still can not say the tip is turning so at this point the tip is load is bearing on the cheap roller pin that has a small capacity for load then a steel stamp tip rocker and you still are not using a bearing trunnions but a ball pivot a full roller rocker may help with friction .he will never see any added hp from a tip that may not work and the cost is all most $160 when a fully roller as $205 boy oh boy that.s a no brainer .i really do not care what DAVE V said. i do my own thinking on this . you can not? i will only to say that that cut and past you did is talking about a roller rocker not just a tip. yep and my chevy truck ran for over 200.000 miles with stock rocker arm and valve guldes GOOD GOD when will it stop the crime in this world .... tango keep dreaming running this B.S when the kid will be lucky to see any hp from a roller tip rocker keep dreaming show me the dyno numbers and that they can last as long as stock stuff on this engine ??? i see this as you i am sure have used more stock stuff and i used more and sold more T&Ds jesels .crane .crower. harland sharp s and other you get the point? so to say i do not use this stuff would not be true and to say you should know that a stock rocker will work fine ? he will not see any power from the roller tip ? that going to be worth any thing ? OH hey lets put roller bearing in for the cam as this could help him to ?

You know you should have red that and Learned something . But I guess you think your smarter then David Vizard ? Your not and never will be . And from a Engine Builder that can't Build a Flat Tappet SB Chevy that will Live ? I sure would take what you say about Rockers with a grain of salt . You Like to think you know so Much ya don't fool me . Try and trash Me the best you can You know this old Boy can do what He says He can Oh Yeah you know it You have a Lot to Learn but with your mind set Like it is . You will stay Like you are

Originally Posted by tango

Ok I have not opened many Hot Rod Books for some time now Ha-Ha . But I did remember David Vizard talked about this in one of his many H.P Book's .

Here are his thoughts ( The operating tip of roller rocker rolls across the tip of the valve , side loading on the valvestem is dramatically reduced, this increases stem and guide life . and since high valve lift can greatly increase side load and wear , especially if you use stamped-steel , stud mounted rockers )

Ok I would go by what He said . My thoughts / 2 Cents any one can see a round rolling part will have less friction then a Flat part rubbing up and down and walking on another Flat part . They get enough oil I have taking Roller Tip Rockers off with over 100K miles that had no wear on the Roller Tips and the Valves come right out of the Head's you Don't have to file them first .

maybe you should go back and read what i posted ?? i said that the steel stamp rockers do show wear as there as lack of oil to the tip and push rods may not be the right length .to say the tip is flat ? yep when they wear out there flat you would under stand contack point on a rocker / stem point . if you did any mild lift check s ? have you ?

No I never do none off this stuff Ha-Ha . One day I will show you how to build a SB with a Flat Tappet cam and we can use stock rockers ? Oh how much Lift can we go with them ? Do you know ?

Originally Posted by tango

You know you should have red that and Learned something . But I guess you think your smarter then David Vizard ? Your not and never will be . And from a Engine Builder that can't Build a Flat Tappet SB Chevy that will Live ? I sure would take what you say about Rockers with a grain of salt . You Like to think you know so Much ya don't fool me . Try and trash Me the best you can You know this old Boy can do what He says He can Oh Yeah you know it You have a Lot to Learn but with your mind set Like it is . You will stay Like you are

Tango i build sbc flat lifter cam engines that live you really need help ....LET THIS GO ??? i built and machined more flat lifter cam in the last two years then you have. LET IT GO try to get help with this >>> RED ?? no it not hard for me to take you apart. l like to help you look bad its really not hard for me

Originally Posted by tango

no i never do none off this stuff ha-ha . One day i will show you how to build a sb with a flat tappet cam and we can use stock rockers ? Oh how much lift can we go with them ? Do you know ?

oh one.. Day one ..day ..the day is now so now your saying that a stock stamed rocker will work fine for his build ? ok i go along with that .but now for my test for you ? how many hours have you spent setting up t&d s what s the pin for do you use what they send with the shaft ? Max lift on a stock gm or after market stock rocker slot not the same ???

still waiting ? what the size nuts jesel use for there shaft rockers what size bolts do T@D use for there rockers how many turns on the rocker arm cup before you shut oil off to the spring ? what deck do you cut the SBC to ? is the cam plug on a SHP dart block the same as a stock chevy?

Boys, momma always said if you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all. Let's get back to posting civil to one another as if you are talking to each other face to face. Back to the subject of thread, if you can post relevant information, do so, if not, take it offline...........


Bill S.

C'mon you two.. let it go! We all know there are 2 ways to skin a cat! Heck, people tell me all the time I can't do this or can't do that! Makes no difference, my stuff is still going strong! Same with you cats, right! We come here to share some knowledge and have some laughs.. your "exchanges" are becoming boring and are no longer serving a purpose.. Stop thumping your chests , agree to dis-agree, and let's get back to havin' some fun!

I guess Bil and I were typing at the same time with the same sentiment.. 8-)