Thread: Questions about a 1986-1994 block I would like to purchase.

Tweet

Hello all, and hoping someone can solve a problem for me. Hoping Tech Inspector is in the area..

Anyway, rather simple I think, and I will have you know I am completely astonished with the lack of knowledge of most of these guy at the speed shop.

I have a camaro with a 350 in it right now. Oil presure is low (6lbs) at idle. BAD..
The block is a 3970010 typical run of the mill 350. (With lots of good parts on it.) and it runs well. As of now 12.4 and I can get in and drive it across the USA if I wanted, and that is how I like it.(As long as the oil pressure doesn't drop any lower.ha ha)

Anyway, at the speed shop they have a 350 block, # 14093638. Long story, but it is on the stand, just bored 030 over, cooked,clean, new cam bearings ready to go.. 75bucks. My plan was to buy it being that if I pulled my engine out, to have it bored, cleaned ect is gonna cost alot more than 75bucks, so common sense tells me this would be the better move. plus it is a 1 piece real seal.

The question is, are all my parts interchangeable? Why I ask is on this newer block, when you look at the oil galley (under where the intake would sit) there are three holes where bolts would go to hold down what I think is a spring type metal piece for possibly roller lifters. Not sure, and I haven't had a newer chevy apart in a long time.

So, back to where I started. Is this a roller motor block? I wasn't interested in running a roller cam, so who can help me out? Currently I have a solid cam which I like, and wanted to re-use it.

I would think my heads,intake, dist, ect will bolt on like normal, but I am concerned with pushrod length and the lifter bores.

Maybe I am completely wrong, but hoping someone can chime in (without guessing) and help me out. Again, I figure for 75bucks, its a buy. But..If I have to purchase roller lifters and a new cam and pushrods, maybe it isn't a buy, as it would be cheaper to have my block bored.

all sbc with tower s in the lifter valley can be used as a GM roller engine with stock parts for a roller engine with the right push rods. hold down cam . cam retainng plate timming set .lifters/ track bars . cam gear

I thought that what the towers were for. Now the question I was getting at is, "Can I use the current lifters and push rods from my current engine in this block OR do I have to use the roller set up.

And my current set up is as follows (which runs pretty well)

030 block w/flat tops and standard 5.7 rods
Pro comp heads which were cleaned up and ported ect.
Edelbrock dual plane intake w/ 1 inch spacer
Roller rockers
comp cams 305 mag solid cam
750 HP series Holley
Msd Ignition 34degrees total advance w 6/al box
Super comp headers
2500 stall converter
3.73 gears

What I was considering changing was the solid cam I have now (Which I think is too big) to a Lunati 60140 or 60141
I was going to install a single plane intake as the dual plane isn't matched to my combo as far as I am concerned
And I was thinking about installing a small Sniper NOS kit and spraying 100-125 just to maybe put it in the high 11s. if that seems doable.
I like to be able to drive the car around and have fun, so I figure the spray is an easy way to cheat, and it isn't soo much that it will distroy the engine used
once in awhile. Am I on the right track? Opinions please.

As I said, if it were not for the lack of oil presure,I wouldn't even toy with the car as It runs pretty well, but if I am going to pull it apart, might as well change some things I don't like.

Another idea was to get a 383 stroker kit, but that might be more than I want to spend right now. Will it make that much of a difference on the street with a stroker verses a well built 355? If so, I was told to look into a kit from Ohio Crankshaft or Scat. Do I need it internally balanced> Suggestions? tech Inspector has a dyno program. Maybe if you are reading you could toss me some ideas as you seem to be on the ball with this stuff.
It is a 69 camaro.

Back up here first.75 seems too be good to be true and usually is then.

There are oem blocks with the spider bosses drilled and tap that where not roller hydro's.A prime example is my 1995 383 block that was a flat tappet hydro.Well honestly 1995 was a transition yr so they came threw both ways.So the short answer is yes you use your stuff.

But..............you didn't say if your block was decked or the heads where cut.That could effect push rod length.
Oil pressure or low pressure is a effect of a bearing issue/oil pump issue and not a bore issue.So to reuse your two pc seal crank(again you need to tell us if your block is two pc or one pc seal.Saves us from running after casting numbers)in a one pc seal block requires a seal adapter.So add another 80 to 125 to the price of the 75.00 block.Then getting back to the oil pressure issue,tearing down your block you might find your going to have to turn your crank 10/10 anyways.At that point you current block and it's reuse isn't looking to bad of a option providing your bores don't need much other than hone/ re-ring.Again oil pressure is a function of bearings clearance/then oil pump.A stuck valve in the oil pump "could" provide low oil pressure at idle.

Spraying that little I would want atleast a upgrade on rod bolts.Yep-guys spray that little without ARP bolts,but not on my dollar.The cost benefit makes it silly to do without the better bolts.

The question about the stroker is for one thing the cam you have you might find it is about right to the increased C.I.'s because the 383's will accept a bigger cam more easily then the 355.I own a Howards stroker and I am sold on Howards products.American made and machined and a quality pc.Internal balance that may require Mallory metal.The point of the 383's is the greater torque curve at a lower RPM which what you want on a street vehicle.A major portion of ET is the first 330' where that torque curve plays a huge role.

My advise to you is to tear down what you have first before any $75 dollar deal to see what is the problem with the oil pressure and take a look at the bores,etc to asses the costs.

Also-I agree that Richard is very knowledgeable.The thing is Pat has been in the business of building engines for yrs as Jerry has and has hands on experience.If I where you,I would listen to either of them very closely.They tell you alot in one sentence.

the roller block you can use your flat lifter cam but need to use the pushrods for this setup . as for ohio or scat i have used both and others scat/pbm is what i use most of the time

Maybe Pat or Jerry can chime in and tell me if I'm full of crap or not, but personally I would be very hesitant about buying a block that has been pre-bored without the pistons.

If I’m not mistaken different type of pistons require slightly different clearance.....there is also the question of the final finish on the cylinders being compatible with the type of rings used.

Then there are the pistons themselves......although it’s not as bad as it was 45 years ago (god have I really been doing it that long LOL), I have had occasions where pistons have not all been exactly the same size within the set.

Maybe it’s just me and I’m being over critical, but I really hate going back into a freshly built engine.

well i can not think its much of any thing at $75 for a hot tank and bore /hone . at that price . i do not finsh hone a block with out pistons and most of the time i bore them with the deck plate on so i like the pistons in hand.must be more to this red hot deal ?

Thanks for the input all of you.

The reason it is so cheap is that some girl who was getting a divorce has been stopping in my buddies speedshop and bringing them all kinds of stuff that her ex had in the garage. The block was on an engine stand, and they offered her $75 bucks for it, as they really didn't need it, but hey, I guess she didn't either.

My old block is a 2 piece rear seal block, as stated by the numbers I posted, and this is a 1 piece rear seal block. I put a bore guage in the holes and they are all dead on 4.030.

I am aware of why the oil presure is low, well, shouldn't say that because the block isn't apart, but I know what causes low oil presure. Maybe it is only the pump spring, but I have a feeling it is more than that because when I bought the car it was set up with the incorrect plugs and the carb was SUPER RICH. I don't beleive in tuning cars by ear ( I work at a Lexus dealer) so I am pretty anal about fixing/doing things correct the first time, which is why I am doing the research on this block. I know it is only 75bucks, but I have to spend too much on parts I don't have, that would defeat the purpose. Plus I thought it would be nice to put this engine on a stand, order the bottom end, put it together and then pull my engine and swap heads, oilpan, front pieces, ect and have the job done over the weekend.

When I put the car on the dyno a few months back, I managed to get 21hp extra out of it by DE-jetting the car and backing down the timing from 45 total to about 34, which is how the speed shop that built it and tuned it had it set up. I also let up on the valve lash a few thousands, but I forget exactly where it ended up.

Which also I should bring to your attention, I have a scope I use as a bore scope. Not a snap on type, but it is what a doctor uses to look up your nose. Super clear picture, and when I stuck it in the spark plug holes, the tops of the pistons are a mess from all the detonation from the original tuning before I bought the car, so I am betting that there was so mush fuel being dumpped into the engine that is thinned the oil and caused bearing failure.

What do you think of my suggestion on the new parts verses the current parts for the engine?

So do you think given the scope that in the short block of your engine you have anything salvageable??.

Well, from what I noticed the pistons looked beat. Wasn't planning on re-using them anyway. I guess I really don't need to re-use much on anything other than the pushrods, and if I get lucky maybe they used H-beam rods. That would be nice surprise. Crank won't work as it is a 2 piece, don't really like the cam, and I sure wouldn't re use lifters..Who knows. Guess when I pull it apart I will find out.

Talked to a fellow today at the machine shop, and he informed me that I was correct about the bosses being used for the roller cam, and that if I wish to not use them, that is fine, that I can use a regular cam and lifters and all else is just fine. (I thought so, but I would rather ask.) So looks like we are in good shape. thanks guys.

You might have missed it,but you can use a two pc seal crank in a one pc seal block by using a rear main seal adapter.

I also suggest you re-read what Pat posted about how to finish bore/hone a block once you have the pistons.It is a important point because your considering a block already bored .030 over.

Thank you for bringing that point up about the adapter. Which is the best way to go? Reason I ask is that I have my original balancer and my flex plate. If I order a kit that has a 2 pc crank, I won't need to buy a new balancer or flex plate I assume, where as if I buy a 1 pc crank, I guess the bolt pattern on the crank is different. Very good point. Does Jegs or summit sell the adapter? Will I be able to use my oil pan as well. I would think so.

Before that,I wanted to pass onto you what I was told by Pat and Jerry.The primary question of which would rather own??. A old gen I 350 that is .030 or a new SHP that is a 4.125 bore and is better in every aspect.Yes I know it is very hard to wrap your head around a $1,499 block.I do regret the money I spent on the first gen 350 and it is mainly now I realize that some of these builds don't happen over-nite so over the time it is taken me to get together this 383 build for me to come up with the additional money for a SHP block wouldn't have been significant and the end result by far is tons better.Thicker decks,stronger block,bigger bore capability,it just goes on and on it makes tons of logical sense.

The seal adapter is in the center of this pic.



This will allow a two pc Howards crank in a one pc block



I my case I have a one pc seal flexplate that I will have to buy a 2 pc seal flexplate.