Thread: ’32 3W Coupe roller package advise/opinions wanted

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Okay Mike, before you pull the trigger on that glass body here's one more chance to "get your head right".............. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...EF:MOTORS:1123

Bob, your timing is impeccable. I appreciate that you are looking out for me. Just last night I read an article in one of the rodder magazines about Walden's Brookville chop jobs. Hey, it’s only about $14k more that the standard Brookville Deuce, what a bargain. This one is more in Deuce’s territory, he’s a steel fanatic, he can add another one to his collection when he’s finished with the current coupe. I think I’ll stick to a ‘glass car for my first project, I wouldn’t feel as bad butchering a $9k ‘glass body as I would a $38k steelie .

Mike

Originally Posted by Mike52

This one is more in Deuce’s territory, he’s a steel fanatic, he can add another one to his collection when he’s finished with the current coupe.

I do not need another 3W ... have one
got a roadster also ...

Might be interested in a Victoria

I was at Bobby's shop party the Friday night of the LA Roadster show - and that car is so nice Randy....the F&F is impeccable. I took about 50 pics of it.

At one point, I just say on the edge of the table nearby and stared at it.

Mike -

Are you totally set on buying a body and chassis from the same people? Mixing resin and laying up a body is a pretty dissimilar skill set from TIG welding and geometric suspension theory.....

I have a secret audio system that works from a remote. You cant see it from inside. However you can see it in the trunk.
Secret audio is a good unit and small enough to be hidden any place

Thanks ... do you have a link to Secret Audio on the web ??

Originally Posted by Deuce

Thanks ... do you have a link to Secret Audio on the web ??

Google is your friend

Originally Posted by SirSpeedy

Mike -

Are you totally set on buying a body and chassis from the same people? Mixing resin and laying up a body is a pretty dissimilar skill set from TIG welding and geometric suspension theory.....

Tim, no, I'm not set on getting the chassis from the same people that builds the body. The reason I asked the N&N body is because I've read lots of very positive comments about the quality, fit, and finish on numerous boards. The 1st post in this thread mentioned another opinion that nobody touched on except to say that P&J makes a good chassis. It referred to a Show Me Rod & Custom body and P&J chassis. I also considered an N&N body and a Roadster Shop chassis. I think you're referring to the N&N Fiberglass body and chassis combo, correct? To help clarify that, N&N does not produce the chassis, they are made by another company near N&N. They use American Stamping rails, build the tubular center crossmembers, and build the front & rear crossmembers based on your suspension choices.

One of the things I like about the N&N body/chassis combo is that N&N doesn't put the floor into the body until after your chassis is built and delivered to them. Then they mount the floor to 'your' chassis, and then they attach the floor to your body. This seems like a good process to me, I'd be interested to know what you think, care to comment?


Mike

My Outlaw body was built on an Outlaw chassis. What appealed to me about a body on a rolling chassis from Outlaw was the fact that they assemble your body on your chassis, and as a result, you do not have to shim the body to get the doors to fit correctly. I found the Outlaw frame well made and quite strong. We have not talked much here about Outlaw bodies, but they are super straight. My painter was impressed with the quality of this body and said it took less than a cup of bondo to prep the entire body. You can always tell an Outlaw body because of the 3 3/4 inch chop. In addition, the body moulding around the windshield has been smoothed out and the rear window is from a '33 Chevy which was grafted into the original body on which the molds were taken. If I build another '32, I would not hesitate to order another one of these bodies.

In reference to glassing in the floor on your frame vs any other '32 frame or fixture, I think that might be a little over rated.

The cars I have built have been Wescott, Brookville, or Ford bodies. I built a 5w using a Gibbon body about 10 years ago.

A '32 frame that is assembled in a fixture, to the correct dimensions should be the same as any other '32 frame assembled in a fixture to the correct dimensions. I have been to Wescott's shop, and the fixtures they use to install the floor look like a short section of a frame, the cowl portion to the rearmost body mount.

I haven't been to Brookville, but Scandinavian in Huntington Beach assembles B-ville bodies, and they have '32 rails, cut down from the cowl back, on rolling fixtures to assemble those bodies.

So maybe if it is acceptable for the two best know body manufacturers, who are respected for there quality, to assemble bodies on a random frame or fixture, it must be fine. So I guess my thought process is why would the body manufacturer need or even prefer your frame, if they are assembling their bodies on a proper fixture that ensures accuracy and consistency from body to body?

As for shimming, closed cars aren't that big of a deal to shim up - ALL roadsters of ANY brand need extensive shimming to get everything, door gaps, beltlines, hood lines, fenders to fit - those door hinges have no adjustment - all adjustment is in shimming the cowl and quarters up/down front to back.

I understand the position that any body assembled on a frame/jig that is "to specs" should fit any other frame that is also "to specs", but the specifications have manfacturing tolerances. While they will be close I would challenge that no two frames are going to be truly identical, hence the need for shims to get the gaps right. This is the benefit of having your body assembled on the frame it will ride on - tolerances are accounted for in the body assembly.
From the August '08 build article in Street Rod Builder, N&N not only mounts the floor with the body on the frame, they also build the doors up from inner & outer panels clamped in place on the body to make initial gaps right. They offer a complete chassis/body combo as Mike points out, but I am pretty sure that you can also carry in any quality chassis, for example a roller from Pete & Jakes for them to match up your body to. Others may be as good or better, but from what I have seen so far their approach is a pretty solid value for the dollars they charge.

There is a tolerance, yes, but in the Y plane (vertical) the rails are all the same - there are only 2 people stamping them, and Lobeck and SAC weld up rails - the vertical profile of all 4 major sources of '32 rails(ASC, Weimer, SAC, Lobeck) are the same - certainly within .100" - I've had them all in my jigs and they are all very high quality. So if the width of the frame from the centerline is the Ford spec - they should all be the same. I cannot imagine being able to build a '32 Ford with any body and chassis, and not have to place a single shim under the body anywhere. I've built too many, and know too well how difficult it is to fit a hood on one of these cars. Maybe the definition of "fit" is a little more broad for some of these companies claiming "no shims"

My point is simple - Gibbon, Ravon and others have trumpeted the great benefit of glassing the floor in on the frame the body will ride on - this is not new - I know nothing of the NN bodies - but this is the same deal.

TONS of super-high quality cars are turned out by So-Cal, Lobeck, Brizio, SRRC, Cali Street Rods, Limeworks, Circle City, every year with bodies and frames that have never seen each other until they both arrive at the shop of those guys.

One issue with reproduction frames is the width. If you are going to run fenders ... the frames are too narrow. The fenders hang on the rear body panel and then drop down to the frame.



With the frame too narrow, you can end up with a space in between the fender and the frame. I have seen this gap as large as 1/2 of a inch. Then the running boards are not out far enough to line up with the outer edge of the fender.

As " flexible " as the fiberglass bodies are I am with SirSpeedy
I do not really see the advantage of the body being built on the chassis it will finally be on. They move around a good bit ... and some SMELL pretty rank after sitting in the hot sun all day. Most of the fiberglass body guys suggest that you NOT paint your fiberglass cars a dark color.

The ONLY advantage I could see is that with the new body sitting on the intended chassis ... it might cure up better sitting on it than sitting some where else.

I helped a friend with a chopped 32 3W Wescott body ... and we installed it on a original 32 chassis ... and it fit like a glove. It barely was wide enough to sit down over the rails. Bolted it down ... with webbing in between it and the frame and everything was just right.

________________________________

For those of you who have never built a 32 Ford

The body actually sits over the frame and hangs over. The floor is recessed up into the body about a inch and a half. This photo is all I have of showing the way the floor and sub rails are recessed. I know, black floor in the 3W does not make for the best photo.

Hey Deuce, is that a Serta or a Sterns & Foster that you laid the body to rest on?

I suspect that the appeal of a body assembled on it's eventual foundation is based in axiety over the possible unknowns of shimming to the less experienced builder. Learning to shim can be intimidating, and certainly frustrating as you find that you end up redoing certain portions of the job as you add more components (especially when getting the front sheetmetal on) and what looked "good" before ends up being the victim of stacked (pun intended) tolerences.