Thread: How Dangerous is Drag racing

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I can't imagine the horror of seeing Shelly Howard's dragster going back up track. What terrible misfortune to crash right into her son.

I wonder what weird cosmic event was going on that day?

Racing on the street is for people who want to kill themselves and others.
In drag racing you have a body and roll gage around you. The other day I saw a guy hit the wall at about 200mph at fontana raceway and walked away with out a scratch.
Remember this the more speed you put into a car the safety should be added as well.

Drag Racing, indeed racing of any kind any where no matter under what sanctioning and no matter with what safty equipment and rules adhered to is DANGEROUS by its very nature, thats whay ALL tracks make u sign a safty waiver acknowling that fact before u enter even if its just as a spectator.
I have been drag racing in my own rides that i tuned n drove and owned since my 1st one on July 5, 1963.
I have owned, raced with, and or raced against most of the nostalgic cars that folk these days glorify in hindsight, many of whom seeming to know more about em than they could since the cars were long gone before they were so much as born, let alone were old enuff to buy and race cars.
Tho i have been predominantly a STREET RACER, i was indoctrinated into it by the OLD SCHOOL guys, many of whom were uncles in my family.
However, i have also spent more time RACING at tracks than many have spent at a track PERIOD. Its been my experience that MOST injuries and the most horrific injuries that result from a drag race, happen at the track, not on the street. The fact is, that at least on weekends, there is MORE racing going on at tracks around the nation than there is on the street. In fact; much of what folk consider street racing ISN'T. its street stupid, practiced by the Fast n Furious imitation crowd, and the biker boys imitators too; and there is really more talk and BS Bluffs, sellin wolf tickets and making excuses than actual racing any more and NO ONE really has any heart about it. few will bet and most who call a bet try to call something exhorbitant such that the other guy will back off. Many just wanna run for chits n giggles too(free).
But don't get it twisted, its the same at the track. EVERYONE wants to win but damn few want it to b a RACE to do so, they prefer a run away win, even if it results from the other guy breaking his or her ride. Even better they would prefer to intimidate with show and tell such that they expect MOST would b AFRAID to even ASK them to race, all of which they count as legitimate wins.
If you race on the street, YOU MUST do so with respinsibility to urself and others that you PAY the TRACK to exercise for you.
make as sure as u can that u race at a time and in a place and manner where should injury or mishap occur the one most endangered is urself and or ur competition. Racing down thru residential areas, at or near peak traffic hours on peak traffic roads and such, and or from stop light to stop light weaving in and out of traffic, or even what they call roll ons on the E-way thru traffic at wild MPH numbers is NOT STREET RACING, That is street stupid, practiced by street SQUIRRELS, not street racers. Plain old wreckless driving and endangerment.
Also, those among us who claim to b track only oriented have at some point RACED on the street, and or at least went to spectate on same. Those who never actually RACED on the street did not do so because they could never muster the nads to step up and line up, and those who no longer do it stopped because they LOST the nads to step up and line up. They haven't the know how or expertise to b RESPONSIBLE for themselves as they pay a track to appear to do for them. At the track, u pay the officials to make sure that YOU and YOUR car as well as others are operated and constructed in a safe manner. On the street, this is responsibility u must take for urself.
At the track, u can sit back and watch the time trials and clocks, n KNOW for sure who you can deal with and who u can't as far as racing. On the street you must discern this for urself, which means u must know almost as much about the possibilities and capabilities of what you race against as u do what you race WITH. few so called racers ever gain that type of knowledge and experience or even want to, most are so brand loyal that they are also brand blind. They want to win but few if any want it to involve a RACE to do so, certainly nothing competetive.
Another myth and falacy that i will dispell right here, the amulance and paramedic personel at the track ONLY MAKE YOU safer IF the track is beside or within 1/4 mile of a Hospital with a major trauma unit, and NONE are.
An example, Dale Earnheart. Muti million dollar team at a multi million dollar track with all the best safty equipment and practices around and in the car. Ambulances and paramedics immediately on hand, still DEAD AS HELL from RACING and dead as hell AT THE track. As have far more racers been than on the street.
In Point of fact, MOST incidents and injuries on the street attributed to street racing actually have little if anything to do with a street race.
If an acdident and or injuries involve at least one built or hgh perf car and hgh speed its counted as street racing. most of the time its just 2 clowns jockeying for traffic position, not a race.
Not long ago in the Motor City for example, what was thought to b a street race that killed 3 folk and had the whole state up in arms against street racing turns out to actually b a couple of clowns who HAPPEN to b driving a Grand National and an Impala SS who were chasing behind each other shooting at each other resultant of a drug deal gone bad, not a race at all. Once here, a friend who also has a Trans AM like my 77 that CAME with a 455 Pontiac, a very rare 455 auto 77 car at that, was arrested and charged with street racing as well as vehicicular murder after hitting and killing a drunken partier chasing a soft ball across 4 lanes and a turning lane of 45 mph posted traffic just about the time church was letting out on Sunday(it was the drunks Birthday). This was in spite of the fact that he was just missed by a full sized Linc Continental driven by a minister and his wife who were passing my friend in his Trans Am at the time, AND stated same at the scene.
It was labeled as a street race because after the incident had occured and my friend had turned around and returned to the scene another hot rod owner who just happened to know us, came thru in his BUILT Z28 Camaro, caming, so it was claimed that the incident resulted from these two folk drag racing on the street. both guys had their cars impounded for months, and were charged with the same charges w/o any evidence, in fact evidence contrary to the police claims of a drag race. After 2 years of court battles and attorney fees my frind was convicted on the count of Vehicular Man slaughter and wreckless driving. After another 2 years of fees and costs he was able to win an appeal and clear himself. The other fellow who had zero to do with the incident was coerced and frightened into copping a plea which resulted in him serving 6 months on work release and paying 20K in fines and restitutions. not to even mention 2 years of attorney fees and court costs as well.
Always remember that ALL forms of auto racing BEGAN on the street, and the tracks and movies are an imitation of THAT, not the other way around. If by some massive stroke of law enforcement one were able to actually END all forms of street racing, within a year at most there wouldn't b a track of any type open on planet Earth. Reason being, there would b NO fan base to which to advertise the wares of the sponsors or sell to. The only folk at a track who make any money are the owners and those who work for them, and the sponsors and advertisers who's names u see plastered all over the tracks and many of the cars. The latter do not MAKE any money actually at the track, only their hired drivers and team members do. They, like all but the owners and workers at the track only spend money there, they don't make any.
Essentrually the tracks have become places where sponsors can show case their wares and equipment (advertise) so as to race on sunday and sell on monday. Not to the racers at the tracks either, they GIVE them money and parts, and even if they were selling to the racers at the track, there arn't enuff of them for a company to make a profit selling to, especially on the big ticket items anyway. They make their money off the folk who street race and even those folk who are just wanna B's and never race at all at the track or on the street. Auto makers do the same thing by sponsoring race teams.
Do you actually believe that auto makers are producing and selling cars with as much as 800bhp from the factory off the showroom floor and expecting that the buyer is only going to use same at a track ? If that were so why would they not ONLY TEST EM at a track, why would they test and advertise the results of same on the street ?...too potential BUYERS ?
Right, they wouldn't.....
This is not to say that street racing isn't illegal or even that it shouldn't b illegal, it is illegal; and with GOOD REASON. That reason is that the illegallity offers a public measure of control upon something that would surely get far more out of control than it is without the spectre of illegality. I for one feel llike anyone who is unwilling or unable to exercise the same responsibility for themselves and others on the street that they pay a track to seeminlgy exercise FOR them at the track should confine their racing to the track. I; even as a devout street racer; will put the law on ya if I see ya out there practicing the stupid chit that folk assume is street racing...and quick ain't fast enuff to describe how soon i'de have the law on ya either.
In the end as i said in the begining, Racing, in whatever form, at whatever venue is inherantly dangerous by its very nature, and Dale Earnheart is DEAD PROOF that no track can make it any safer than it is really for anyone but the spectators. But then, recently a tire flew off a drag rail into the stands and killed a lady, as well as injured a number of other folk.
So even spectators are not nessecarily any more safe at the track than on the street.
How dangerous is racing ? VERY VERY DANGEROUS, no matter where or when u partake of it even as a spectator.

Nice book wizard well said.

At a drag strip there are none of these to hit.

One note (not to support street racing however) is that almost all street racing gets thrown into the category of "Drag Racing" even if the cars have been swerving in and out of traffic for five miles and there is no "finish line" defined.....just driving stupid gets called drag racing by the news people.

Wizard,

Given your first car being 1963,you are of the same age group as I.I am 62yrs old.I think without question we both know why tracks where developed.At that time more young people where in fact getting killed in street racing events.

I don't want my kids,grand kids,or anyone in my family to race on the street.If they are not prepared to race on a drag race track,then they get benched.Period.No excuses.

If you read my thread about the little racer that can make money racing at a track,you would see that it is possible.

Years ago a good friend of mine named Dicky Polle who was younger than me and looked up to me,I helped him build up a 57 Chevy street car.Dicky had proven to me over and over again he could handle his car.A 1:30am call change all that.He killed himself in a street race hitting a tree.Trust me that when I went to his funeral and his father who treated me for yrs like his second son,told me I killed his son,it has been a life long heart ache never forgotten.

I too have had track drag race friends hurt in crashes.One twice in a major crashes.He survived mainly due the track staff and emergency personnel that
was on scene.And yes,there wasn't a hospital within 1/2hr away.

You can not or should not use track crashes as examples of how effective track facilities are in saving lives.Nor the unusually event of spectators being hurt.That is not the norm.More often than not,those factors prevent the above.Might add,that Dale's death gave info to help prevent that like of thing from happening again.

Question without all the sanctioning rules being applied to street race cars,how many drivers walk away from a crash??.How many street race cars are built well enough??.How many street race car drivers wear fire gear??.Heck-how many even wear the basic helmet??.And hands down with stop signs,crossing traffic,and all the elements that are involved with street racing and not on the track..............well ya think these street racers would be safety to the hilt.But we both know that isn't the truth,don't we??.


I am living proof the rules work.Very early on my race career I multi flipped a car at a track.Short of a concussion and permanent little finger injury,I walked away.Very sore,but two weeks later I was back in a car racing at the track.

As far as sponsors(ed) cars selling products to street guys,well sure there will always be a element of that.It is just "like mike" thing.All I am going to say with me and the people around me for yrs and yrs at the track.......We have mentored young people to race at the track.We have watched families bring up their kids there.We have watched those same kids move up in the classes at the track.None that I know of have gotten a ticket for speeding,or anything else.WHY-well they get all they want at the track.And some have grow up to be very successful in their lives outside of the racing/track I think in no small part to the family they where brought up by at the track.

So no excuses,old dogs like us know better.Street racing overall doesn't get -er-done.

Some races are down right scary! Note the police ready to take action, better at a sanctioned track! These guys obviously have dangerous treads to begin with, one slip and loss of traction and it's a broken ankle!

they ought to arrest all the parents that took there children there

ur correct in that at a drag strip there are none of those to hit, but there are walls and barriers, over which parts often fly and kill or injury spectators....
O by the way, that appears not the result of street racing but of being STREET STUPID, anywhere even remotely safe to race on any street in any city i have street raced in, and i have street raced in some of the largest cities in the U S, Chicago, Philidelphia, Milwaikee, St. Louis, Houston, Dallas, Memphis, Little Rock, Indianapolis just to name a few, as well as i have been to tracks and raced in all these areas, no street that is remotely safe to race on in any place i have raced has any of THOSE to hit either, tho SOME do have walls and barriers.
Next, a street race, a real street race does not include the hordes of spectators, nor does it occur at peak traffic times or even on peak traffic streets even in OFF hours.
As i say most of you who actually dobn'tr know anything about street racing, certainly not REAL street racing as it MUST b practiced if ur to b responsible on the street, so, like with these pictures u ASSume that THAT type of crap is what STREET RACING is all about and it IS NOT!!!
Street Racing, indeed racing period is NOT FOR EVERYONE, and NO MATTER where or with what u partake of ANY type of racing it is inherantly dangerous by its very nature, and the tracks are NO EXCEPTION, they have never been nor will they ever b.
Also, STREET RACING IS ILLEGAL, as well it should b, since its a public measure of control for activities practiced on PUBLIC ROADS. However, u can take to the bank that NO LAW ENFORCEMENT wants to completely eliminate street racing, and neither does any auto maker let alone any hgh perf aftermarket parts supply folk, they simply want to limit same in such a manner that the general public is not up in ARMS about it. Street racing generates BILLIONS of dollars in revenue for all these entities including law enforcement and i can gurantee you not a one wants it to STOP, THAT would not b good for business, thus it doesn't make sense, and business do not do or encourage things that do not make sense or lowers their bottom line, MAKE no mistake about it; Law Enforcement these days is as much BUSINESS as it is anything else, why do u think poor folk go to jail for things rich folk walk on ?
Right, its Business, like with everything else YOU can BUY ur favorite brand of Justice or law enforcement cash or credit.
Another myth to dispell, there is NOTHING NEW ON THE BOOKS anywhere that police can or will do to you if ur caught street racing, not one single thing, i been doin it since 63 so i can say for a fact there isn't. I been busted dead to rights before during and after a street race, worse i ever got was unsafe start, speeding, and i have been towed once, and THAT was because i had a flat on a slick and no spare. Tire went down AFTER i was stopped, When i was released with a stern warning, i called my auto club service and had my car towed HOME, FREE!!!! In point of fact, most of my instances of being caught street racing have ended just like that, a stern warning.
1st, if ur street racing responsibly, only a current or former street racer cop is goin to know where to look for ya, let alone when, that or someone in the family of a current or former street racer. When caught by such an officer, or any officer, what happens to you depend on where, when and HOW ur caught, and morew than anything, your demeanor with the officer who catches you. give him a whole lot of BS and excuses trying to get OUT of and ur hit, and never never try to run, pull over immediately...YOU were doing something illegal, at the very least u should have been MORE CAREFULL, otherwise u wouldn't have gotten caught, step up and b responsible for that. Tell the officer the truth, try to find a common, preferablely jovial ground to come to with the officer.
For instance: I was busted dead to rights after a 200 buck street race, copper was backed off in the dark just past the finish line, and wasn't the friendliest of officers to begin with by a long shot. Just by being responsible and respectful of the mans intelligence, as was my competition, by the time i was being written my citation(speeding less than 10 over in a 55 mph zone); i asked the cop if it was okay to collect my winning from my competitor, he jovially replied, " Yea, ur gonna need it to help pay this ticket im about to give you". Told my competitor he needed to b more selective in whom they race, since he jus lost 200 bucks and the price of a citation.. my comp replied that he would win it back, and the cop replied he had 14 days to do so......
As a matter of fact, he DID win it back and in less than 14 days as i recall, but not off me.....
Don't get me wrong, im not encouraging street racing of tryin to enlist any more comp, ther is more than enuff already out there and many of em are not as responsible as i would have em to b so SOME of them i'de well like to b rid of... those whom i'de prefer limit thier racing to a track if they race at all. By the same token, if ur a track junkie, all about going to the track only to race, so be it, to each his or her own, but don't b lookin down ur nose at me for racin the street, but for folk like me u'de have no track to go to and NO aftermarket supplier of hgh perf parts to buy from either. NOR have u any more nads than me with all the talk about street racers being scared to go to the track and see what their car really runs. It take a lot more nerve to line up and race, especially for money, when u DON'T know what you or ur comp is running, it certainly takes more nerve to do it on the street looking out for cops to add tickets and other expense to ur lil race budget not to mention points to ur lic and raised insurance costs. In Point of fact, as many tracks as i have been to and raced at, i have yet to see or hear of one that it takes half the nerve to race at as it does the most responsible and safe place on the street anywhere anytime u could find. IMHO, thos who are not willing to line up under such adverse circumstances and put their money where their mouth is are the ones afraid, not the STREET RACERS, most of them have TOO much nerve. Besides, 90 per cent of the cars of folk who talk the most badly about street racing could easily and locally find a REAL Racer, with a REAL street car who would trailor u on the street OR at the track. A real street racer doesn't actually care what their car runs at the track, u'll; never find track conditions on the street. Even if u run the street uncorked in the exact same tune as at the track, ur guranteed to loose at least a half sec off ur ET, and giving car lenths on the street ain't even like givin bulbs and spots at thet track. When u give a handicap at the track, both cars still have to cover a 1/4 or 1/8 mile, not so when u give car lenths, tho each car lenth equals about 1/10th of a sec up to a point. when u give a car lenth u not only make ur competitor instantly 1/10th per quicker, u give them 1 ea fewer cars lenths to cover to the finish line....
Then there is all that givin em the break, the leave etc. that ain't like someone out reactin u on the tree at the track and can easily put u 1/2 sec or more in the chit right off the line. AT the track, reaction time does not effect what ET u turn, the clocks don't start till u move, not so on the street, reaction time is part of ur ET. It ain't about how fast ur goin when u finish, or even what et ya ran after u actually moved on the street, its all about the overall time it took u to get there, including the reaction time. As i say, takes a lot more nerve and expertise to race successfully on the street than at the track, AND u need MORE power, since as a REAL STREET car ur goin to b heavier in addfition to more traction limited.
I can say this from experience, i have been drag racing, predominantly on the street in my own rides that i bought, wrenched and raced since July 5, 1963, successfully for the past 25 years now...by that i mean that for the past 25 years i have made more off street racing than it cost me in repairs, maintanenance and upkeep and losses to do it. for 2009, i cleared 5700, had 31 paid races, 5 of which i LOST!!!!
a day at the track is gonna cost ya nearly 100 bucks if ya jus go as a spectator, not to mention take a race car there and race all day..fuel for the race car, fuel for the tow vehicle, entry fees etc...at the end of which, IF UR MOST fortunate, u have beat the hell out of ur ride for at least 8-10 passes and won maybe a trophy; while ya spent over 200.....
i can hit the street, have 2 or even ONE race and make 200 bucks while spending less than 25 to do it. That is MY imputus for street racing, prophit margin. I see nothing nobel about beatin the crap out of my ride makin passes for free, let alone payin to do it.

Originally Posted by MrWizard455

ur correct in that at a drag strip there are none of those to hit, but there are walls and barriers, over which parts often fly and kill or injury spectators....

(NONSENSE!!!!)




O by the way, that appears not the result of street racing but of being STREET STUPID, anywhere even remotely safe to race on any street in any city i have street raced in, and i have street raced in some of the largest cities in the U S, Chicago, Philidelphia, Milwaikee, St. Louis, Houston, Dallas, Memphis, Little Rock, Indianapolis just to name a few, as well as i have been to tracks and raced in all these areas, no street that is remotely safe to race on in any place i have raced has any of THOSE to hit either, tho SOME do have walls and barriers.


Next, a street race, a real street race does not include the hordes of spectators, nor does it occur at peak traffic times or even on peak traffic streets even in OFF hours.

(Your kidding right??).


As i say most of you who actually dobn'tr know anything about street racing, certainly not REAL street racing as it MUST b practiced if ur to b responsible on the street, so, like with these pictures u ASSume that THAT type of crap is what STREET RACING is all about and it IS NOT!!!
Street Racing, indeed racing period is NOT FOR EVERYONE, and NO MATTER where or with what u partake of ANY type of racing it is inherantly dangerous by its very nature, and the tracks are NO EXCEPTION, they have never been nor will they ever b.
Also, STREET RACING IS ILLEGAL, as well it should b, since its a public measure of control for activities practiced on PUBLIC ROADS. However, u can take to the bank that NO LAW ENFORCEMENT wants to completely eliminate street racing, and neither does any auto maker let alone any hgh perf aftermarket parts supply folk, they simply want to limit same in such a manner that the general public is not up in ARMS about it. Street racing generates BILLIONS of dollars in revenue for all these entities including law enforcement and i can gurantee you not a one wants it to STOP, THAT would not b good for business, thus it doesn't make sense, and business do not do or encourage things that do not make sense or lowers their bottom line, MAKE no mistake about it; Law Enforcement these days is as much BUSINESS as it is anything else, why do u think poor folk go to jail for things rich folk walk on ?


(Some more delusions,???)


Right, its Business, like with everything else YOU can BUY ur favorite brand of Justice or law enforcement cash or credit.
Another myth to dispell, there is NOTHING NEW ON THE BOOKS anywhere that police can or will do to you if ur caught street racing, not one single thing, i been doin it since 63 so i can say for a fact there isn't. I been busted dead to rights before during and after a street race, worse i ever got was unsafe start, speeding, and i have been towed once, and THAT was because i had a flat on a slick and no spare. Tire went down AFTER i was stopped, When i was released with a stern warning, i called my auto club service and had my car towed HOME, FREE!!!! In point of fact, most of my instances of being caught street racing have ended just like that, a stern warning.
1st, if ur street racing responsibly, only a current or former street racer cop is goin to know where to look for ya, let alone when, that or someone in the family of a current or former street racer. When caught by such an officer, or any officer, what happens to you depend on where, when and HOW ur caught, and morew than anything, your demeanor with the officer who catches you. give him a whole lot of BS and excuses trying to get OUT of and ur hit, and never never try to run, pull over immediately...YOU were doing something illegal, at the very least u should have been MORE CAREFULL, otherwise u wouldn't have gotten caught, step up and b responsible for that. Tell the officer the truth, try to find a common, preferablely jovial ground to come to with the officer.
For instance: I was busted dead to rights after a 200 buck street race, copper was backed off in the dark just past the finish line, and wasn't the friendliest of officers to begin with by a long shot. Just by being responsible and respectful of the mans intelligence, as was my competition, by the time i was being written my citation(speeding less than 10 over in a 55 mph zone); i asked the cop if it was okay to collect my winning from my competitor, he jovially replied, " Yea, ur gonna need it to help pay this ticket im about to give you". Told my competitor he needed to b more selective in whom they race, since he jus lost 200 bucks and the price of a citation.. my comp replied that he would win it back, and the cop replied he had 14 days to do so......
As a matter of fact, he DID win it back and in less than 14 days as i recall, but not off me.....
Don't get me wrong, im not encouraging street racing of tryin to enlist any more comp, ther is more than enuff already out there and many of em are not as responsible as i would have em to b so SOME of them i'de well like to b rid of... those whom i'de prefer limit thier racing to a track if they race at all. By the same token, if ur a track junkie, all about going to the track only to race, so be it, to each his or her own, but don't b lookin down ur nose at me for racin the street, but for folk like me u'de have no track to go to and NO aftermarket supplier of hgh perf parts to buy from either. NOR have u any more nads than me with all the talk about street racers being scared to go to the track and see what their car really runs. It take a lot more nerve to line up and race, especially for money, when u DON'T know what you or ur comp is running, it certainly takes more nerve to do it on the street looking out for cops to add tickets and other expense to ur lil race budget not to mention points to ur lic and raised insurance costs. In Point of fact, as many tracks as i have been to and raced at, i have yet to see or hear of one that it takes half the nerve to race at as it does the most responsible and safe place on the street anywhere anytime u could find. IMHO, thos who are not willing to line up under such adverse circumstances and put their money where their mouth is are the ones afraid, not the STREET RACERS, most of them have TOO much nerve. Besides, 90 per cent of the cars of folk who talk the most badly about street racing could easily and locally find a REAL Racer, with a REAL street car who would trailor u on the street OR at the track. A real street racer doesn't actually care what their car runs at the track, u'll; never find track conditions on the street. Even if u run the street uncorked in the exact same tune as at the track, ur guranteed to loose at least a half sec off ur ET, and giving car lenths on the street ain't even like givin bulbs and spots at thet track. When u give a handicap at the track, both cars still have to cover a 1/4 or 1/8 mile, not so when u give car lenths, tho each car lenth equals about 1/10th of a sec up to a point. when u give a car lenth u not only make ur competitor instantly 1/10th per quicker, u give them 1 ea fewer cars lenths to cover to the finish line....
Then there is all that givin em the break, the leave etc. that ain't like someone out reactin u on the tree at the track and can easily put u 1/2 sec or more in the chit right off the line. AT the track, reaction time does not effect what ET u turn, the clocks don't start till u move, not so on the street, reaction time is part of ur ET. It ain't about how fast ur goin when u finish, or even what et ya ran after u actually moved on the street, its all about the overall time it took u to get there, including the reaction time. As i say, takes a lot more nerve and expertise to race successfully on the street than at the track, AND u need MORE power, since as a REAL STREET car ur goin to b heavier in addfition to more traction limited.
I can say this from experience, i have been drag racing, predominantly on the street in my own rides that i bought, wrenched and raced since July 5, 1963, successfully for the past 25 years now...by that i mean that for the past 25 years i have made more off street racing than it cost me in repairs, maintanenance and upkeep and losses to do it. for 2009, i cleared 5700, had 31 paid races, 5 of which i LOST!!!!
a day at the track is gonna cost ya nearly 100 bucks if ya jus go as a spectator, not to mention take a race car there and race all day..fuel for the race car, fuel for the tow vehicle, entry fees etc...at the end of which, IF UR MOST fortunate, u have beat the hell out of ur ride for at least 8-10 passes and won maybe a trophy; while ya spent over 200.....
i can hit the street, have 2 or even ONE race and make 200 bucks while spending less than 25 to do it. That is MY imputus for street racing, prophit margin. I see nothing nobel about beatin the crap out of my ride makin passes for free, let alone payin to do it.

Soooooooooo,your saying for 25yrs you couldn't .............at the track,Well ok.There you have it.

Here is the deal Wizard.You and I will never agree.That seems very clear.For the sake of the forum community in general I will not post to this thread any longer.I suggest you consider doing the same.

Gary

Put a fork in this thread, it's done.

even the drag racing i did on the streets 30 years ago were mostly organised events with temporary christmas trees and traffic control.. we did have our speed racers who prefered top end stuff .. most of them are long dead .. big trees and poles dont move very quick ..

No delusions at all sir, as i say i have been an avid and active street racer since July 5, 1963 as well as participating at drag strips all over the mid west of the country, Ill, Wis,Mo,TX,TN,AR,IN,MS,OH,KY, and Pennsylvania in and around Philidelphia where i LIVE for MOST of 1968 before joining the military and going to Viet Nam.
So, I'M talking facts that i KNOW from actual experience while ur tryin to start some beligerance talkin smack about thing u have but heard or read about as if its something that u actually KNOW from some experience. Like as not i was doin this with my nose deep in it when ur parent werte poopin themselves if not bed wetting, in MY OWN RIDES that I BOUGHT, Wrenched and DROVE.
As i say, im not condoning street racing, nor am i trying to encourage ay new entrants, we have quite a few whom i'de prefer keep their racing at the track if they race at all cause i see them unsafe and inexperienced at it no matter where they do it, YOU for instance. Street Racing, with good reason is ILLEGAL, but the fact that all tracks as well as the sponsors who sponsor said tracks and many of the rides and teams who participate therte owe the greatest of their revenue, indeed nearly ALL of same to those folk who race the street far more than they do the track if they even race at all. Auto makers make the bulk of their profits on sellin hgh perf cars to everyday folk to drive on the street, most of whom never even take the car to a track to b a spectator let alone race it, and they damn sure sell damn few hgh perf cars to race teams, matter of fact most race teams buy a plain jane and clonbe it into a hgh perf offering that is in NO WAY SIMULAR to the actual car u may see on the street other than outward appearance, so for damn sure they ain't sellin many hgh perf offerings to any RACERS. So then who the hell u expect all these folk are expending all this money to advertise and sell to ? Right, the STREET ENTHUSIAST and as i say they make BILLIONS each year off of them, and they never even break even on what they spend at the tracks in any other way than sales resultant from advertisement, in fact that is the budget from which they take what they spend, their advertisement budget.
I know this not only by way of direct participation in the STREET ENTHUSIAST as well as the track scene, but also by way of having a Bachelor Degree in Business Management/Adminstration, from Ouchita Baptist College in Arkadelphia, but also a Mechanical Engineering Degree in Automotive Applications, from Kettering University here in Flint(formerly GMI or General Motors Institute) which was founded/fellowed here by Charles Kettering during his tenure as CEO of Buick Motor Division which was also founded here and is yet the parent and founding division of General Motors itself. GM has Corporate Offices and Headquarter in Both Detroit and New Jersey but the home and Birth place of GM, the UAW and 2 of the only 3 divisions of GM that GM as GM actually created, Chevrolet which was created to deliver for GM an entry level CAR, while GMC later divided out of same was created to produce ALL truck, Bus, and van chasis vehicles which is both their mantras to this very day. no matter what name plate u may see on the latters of those, its produced by GMC and ONLY GMC, predominanly here in Flint which is where the largest GMC operations yet are and always have been. The strike following the division of Chevrolet into Chevrolet and GMC with GMC going to Corporate control while Chevrolet remained under BUICK control yet to this day,and it was created in existing Buick facilities with predominantly existing Buick and Oldsmobile workers; Louis Chevrolet and his brother who were 1st working for FORD while RACING Buicks were pretty much the only NEW HIRES used in the creation of either division. The sit down strike of 1939 here in Flint was over the loss of all seniority of those workers transfered to Corporate from Buick with GMC piled atop the loss of all seniority by former Buick and Olds divsion workers who were assigned to Chevrolet, GM claimed that one could not have any seniority in a here to fore non existant division, while the workers were of the mind that seniority anywhere in GM as a whole should be counted toward retirement. At the time, few auto workers were in ANY union, those who were were seamsters and such from GM's upholstery shops in fisher body who were in the AFL-CIO and those Teamsters who brought in parts and supplies and production between diff facilities and suppliers who were in the TEAMSTERS. this left the hourly workers in various plants at GM, Ford and Chrysler w/o a union and thus no solidarity between them and those auto workers who were in a Union, neither of whom were willing to represent those strikers from Chevrolet and GMC, thus the Auto Workers created their OWN Union, the UAW and by that won the strike despite the best efforts of GM, Ford, and Chryler who hired Pinkerton strike breakers as well as local and state goverment and law enforcement. 1 county sheriff, 1 city policman, 2 pinkerton strike breakers, and 50 strikers were KILLED in the creation of the UAW during the 1939 sit down strike here.
BTW.. Walter P. Chrysler got his start 1st as an Engineer and finally as CEO at Buick Motor Division, hired by GM founder William C. Durant Jr. after HE left the CEO ship of Buick to head GM once he incorporated same based in BUICK and squeezed out the owners;David Dunbar Buick, Charles Whitting and William Fisher; of Buick with proceeds from the 1st stock offering. With backing from The Duponts;who are also from here in Flint having built their 1st Paint facility here on which site yet stands Dupont Paint facilities; Billy Sr. and millionaire Philanthrapist Charles Stewart Mott, Billy Jr. bought or provied a full 80 per cent of the 1st stock issue from the incorporation of Buick into GM with Oldsmobile, his 2cnd aquisition as the dedicated R and D division. This is why GM can NEVER drop Buick, its the parent and founding company under which the corporation was and IS incorporated, as for Oldsmobile, it too can never b deleted, tho it can and has undergone both refocus and name change. Cadillac and Lassalle were independant sister companies, Cadillac making top line while Lassalle built entry level with a touch of class. Billy Durant AQUIRED both, making Lassalle a Buick Model, while making Cadillac a Seperate Line al together with Buick producing Body, chasis, suspension, drive axle and final assembly and paint, while Oldsmobile produced the engine and thru its Hydramatic division the transmission for both Buick AND Oldsmobile as well. Hydramatic became GM's 2cnd division to go from divisional to corporate control in fact. The name change and refocus of Oldsmobile was to Saturn, now that GM plans to stop making Saturn the Division will become JUST Cadillac, but it will still b based in and what its always been, Oldsmobile.
I interject all this about my history and education so as to make abundantly clear that i actually KNOW what im talkin about when it comes to ANYTHING concerning domestic automotive production and competition, ESPECIALLY GM and Drag Racing. Since my 1st drag race, which was a STREET RACE, for money, i have devoted the best of 46 years to this, in terms of hands on and driving and wrenching as well as educational experience, including the BUSINESS side of it. 46 years is undoubtably longer than most of the participants of this thread have been breathing, let alone buying, building or wrenching and racing anything anywhere. Even as a Street Racer i have been to and raced at more tracks than most of you have yet to even go to as a spectatotor. Of those of you who here have RACE, as in only raced at the track cars, i have a couple of STREET and STRIP raced cars which aren't but could b dailey drivers since they have full interiors, appointments, full exhaust complete with tail pipes and run as well as race on pmp gas(92-94 octane)after being driven to and then from the race site, able to exceed rather than just maintain the posted speed limit anywhere in the nation for as long as i supply them with fuel to and from said site n trailer ur ride with the quickness when i get there, on the street or at the track.
In effect, those of u here trying to match wits with me and make me out not to know what im talking about in concerns of this particular topic only actually show ME how ignorant and inexperienced YOU actually are. You should stop while ur not too far behind cause in a battle of wit about much of anything about life at all with me, ur obviously totally unarmed.
However,don't take my word for it, keep being a little hater, folk like me Love haters, every time i find i have one, i try to turn that into at least 3, the more i have the better i must b doin and the more real i must b keeping it.