Thread: A Force ??

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Originally Posted by Mike in Motown

I just dont buy the 'start from scratch' theory, period.

Why don't you try telling that to Garlits, Kalitta, Prudhomme, Eddie Hill, Shirley Muldowney, Fred Stone, Leonard Woods, amongst others?

Originally Posted by Mike in Motown

I was leaving the door(mind) open for someone to chime in with "oh ya, he ran comp or alky car back in the day". What I wasnt expecting is the blessing of some that figure its ok to grab any dude and stick him/her in top level NHRA pro class. Assuming he doesnt have any seat time doesnt this speak to the 'legitimacy' of the current situation? Something that the NHRA outwardly strives for and uses NASCAR as a benchmark?

I just dont buy the 'start from scratch' theory, period.

Neff's bringing some cash to the table or John thinks his magic touch can turn anyone into a winning pro and doesnt wanna pay an extablished driver.

I doubt that. John can afford to hire anyone he wanted.... But why???? So you can try to teach someone with a bunch of habits the Force way of doing things???? And have to fight and argue with him to get things done the way you want them done??? Maybe, just maybe John actually wants to give a young guy who's been working his butt off on the crew a shot at being a driver!!!!! What a strange concept!!!! Helping someone rather then just using them as a stepping stone to get where you want to be!!!! He did it with Robert Hight and it seems to be paying some good dividends!!!!! If you don't buy the starting from scratch theory on driver's, it's because you haven't had a hired driver in your car!!!! I've had a few... One was a very good driver, used to running his own car and doing things his way...he lasted 3 weekends and we sent him packing. I wasn't ready to change our operation to suit him!!! I would imagine hiring a professional, established driver is much the same, only to a far greater degree!!!!

John does a lot of things in an unconventional manner. He does things his way!!! With the record John has, far be it for me to question his choice for a driver!!!!!

Originally Posted by Bob Parmenter

Okay, enough of the serious stuff, how about some gossip that should contribute a little levity. Could be rumor, but a neat story anyway;

Steve Gibbs wrote:

With all the rain here in Seattle, there was ample time to b.s. with the troops today, and the big story going around involves the Jerry Tolliver/Rockstar funny car body fiasco. Goes something like this... Tolliver damaged the body last weekend at Denver when he put it in the sand trap. He makes arrangements for someone to come to the track and pick up the body, and take it to Roush's for repair. Leaving the body in their pit area, the team packs up everything else and heads for the hotel to clean up, with a couple of the crew guys planning on going back to the track to help load the car. During the ensuing time, a coup le of Warren Johnson's crewguys see the thing sitting all by itself and think the body has been abandoned. They proceed to field strip it, taking all the titanium pieces and other trick stuff. Then they decide that parts of the car would make good souvenirs to sell on E-Bay, and cut off the roof, nose section of the car, and a big piecc out of the door area. Well, when Tolliver's guys get back to the track and find out what's happened all hell obviously breaks loose. Cops get involved, and when it's determined W.J.'s crew are responsible, an APB is put out and they are stopped enroute to Seattle. You can imagine what Tolliver's phone call to W.J. must have been like. Anyway, it looks like one of the big name Pro Stock racers just bought a 40k Funny Car body.

Thanks for the "rest of the story" Bob. I've been gone for awhile and only caught this part of the deal.


http://competitionplus.com/index.php...=3478&Itemid=6


That's a funny story. (Well maybe not for everybody).

Originally Posted by NTFDAY

Why don't you try telling that to Garlits, Kalitta, Prudhomme, Eddie Hill, Shirley Muldowney, Fred Stone, Leonard Woods, amongst others?

First of all many of these drivers had experience before running a fuel car so im not sure what you mean here. Secondly it was a different era performance wise and there wasnt a big talent pool to choose from YET!

Also, rules were made in a reactionary fashion, on the fly so to speak. According to most here it seems like the NHRA hasnt changed its rules much as far as driver qualifications go since the days of running in T-shirt and thats the way they like it.

The WJ story just kills me.... a few years back he flipped out ( i would do the same) when a few idiots helped them selves to his doors to his cars.
During rounds many PS take the doors off the car and hang them on the trailer . These guys saw them there and decided they wanted them to sell on ebay. They were busted outside the gate at Richmond and he pressed charges. Now his guys do it
Back to the subject Neff will be fine just like Ashley will.
I have worked on a few Alky cars and 2 fuel cars. Everyone gets in over their head once in a while

The WJ story just kills me.... a few years back he flipped out ( i would do the same) when a few idiots helped them selves to his doors to his cars.
During rounds many PS take the doors off the car and hang them on the trailer . These guys saw them there and decided they wanted them to sell on ebay. They were busted outside the gate at Richmond and he pressed charges. Now his guys do it
Back to the subject Neff will be fine just like Ashley will.
I have worked on a few Alky cars and 2 fuel cars. Everyone gets in over their head once in a while

My point is simply this. Ashley Force deserved a shot as a FC driver because of her past experience in the lower ranks. Her grade so far as a FC driver in my opinion is a C or C-. Will she make it big? Only time will tell but I think she has a good chance.

Neff? Im not sure what the exact NHRA mandate is but if he has no experience on the strip he shouldnt be allowed to go directly to a top pro category without running a lower division for a given amount of time first.
Or anybody else with no experience.

Maybe Force will have him run an alky car for a while. I dont think you can get a fuel FC license without having a lower class license first?

Originally Posted by Mike in Motown

My point is simply this. Ashley Force deserved a shot as a FC driver because of her past experience in the lower ranks. Her grade so far as a FC driver in my opinion is a C or C-. Will she make it big? Only time will tell but I think she has a good chance.

Neff? Im not sure what the exact NHRA mandate is but if he has no experience on the strip he shouldnt be allowed to go directly to a top pro category without running a lower division for a given amount of time first.
Or anybody else with no experience.

Maybe Force will have him run an alky car for a while. I dont think you can get a fuel FC license without having a lower class license first?

He wont run in any class other than a Fuel car. That is what JFR is all about.
You can get a licence for a pro class with out any other type of racing many guys out there have Hight, A. Force, Worsham, Doug Kallitta ( circle track does not count) Dixon many others.
Basically what it used to be was a physical , Orentation test ( blindfolded find all your levers and shutoffs) 1 half track pass, 3 passes more than 660 feet and 2 full runs with 1 of them being with in 1/10 of the national record
So that would be a 5.10 Easy with a good crew and car
Then have it signed by 2 drivers already in that class. And then you got it.
Your 1st 2 qualifying passes at a national event will be solos
I think it is still the same

Originally Posted by iceburgh

He wont run in any class other than a Fuel car. That is what JFR is all about.
You can get a licence for a pro class with out any other type of racing many guys out there have Hight, A. Force, Worsham, Doug Kallitta ( circle track does not count) Dixon many others.
Basically what it used to be was a physical , Orentation test ( blindfolded find all your levers and shutoffs) 1 half track pass, 3 passes more than 660 feet and 2 full runs with 1 of them being with in 1/10 of the national record
So that would be a 5.10 Easy with a good crew and car
Then have it signed by 2 drivers already in that class. And then you got it.
Your 1st 2 qualifying passes at a national event will be solos
I think it is still the same

Well there you have it!

Any Tom, Dick or Harry wins the lottery, completes this short list and WALA, you're a pro!

I knew of these requirements you listed but I thought that for the pro catagories there was some experience required by the NHRA as well.

So I guess I can see why he'd pick Neff over a guy thats negotiated an alky funny down greasy tracks at divisional events.

I think JF purdy' much picked the people he did, because he can. It's the direction he feels is the best rout to take. I doubt he takes the time to get the opinions of armchair forum racers. It's hard to dispute the results he's had to date. Even if we do, makes no difference, it's still JF's choice to hire who he wants.

On a totally unrelated note. Many years ago I had a guy down the street call me up and he said ...... "I'm sending my son down to your shop to help you out for the summer, so he can learn the ropes".
After I picked my jaw up off the floor, and did my best to contain my laughter, I said no & hung up. Don't know why, but this whole deal just reminded me of that event. I still get a chuckle out of it. I wonder if JF gets a kick out of all the chatter, or if he even pays attention to it at all?

Originally Posted by pro70z28

. I doubt he takes the time to get the opinions of armchair forum racers. :

WHAT???????

YOU MEAN HE DOESNT HANG ON MY EVERY WORD BEFORE MAKING DECISIONS??

'GASP', the nerve of him.

Truth be told if I did win the lottery I still wouldnt be able to buy enough gonads to sit in one of those FC's. (but I'd sure as heck hire an experienced driver instead of my neighbor mechanic). But hey thats just me.

Im trying to get up enough nads (and cash) to go to Hawley's school; for a SG license!

Originally Posted by Mike in Motown

Well there you have it!

Any Tom, Dick or Harry wins the lottery, completes this short list and WALA, you're a pro!

I knew of these requirements you listed but I thought that for the pro catagories there was some experience required by the NHRA as well.

So I guess I can see why he'd pick Neff over a guy thats negotiated an alky funny down greasy tracks at divisional events.

What's the big deal!!!! Nobody starts with experience.... Driving an alcohol car is not training for a funny car...other then it's a fast car... The clutch is entirely different, launch procedures are different, tires are different, everything is different....The only way you learn to drive a funny car is by driving a funny car....(Gee, I think I said that before!!!) If someone has a comp license, why shouldn't they be allowed to drive a funny car???? That's how new drivers and new teams get started....If John Force's method of driver selection and training doesn't work, how do you explain Robert Hight???? Pro Drivers should not have some sort of exclusive club.... If you've got the money and or the backing, no reason you can't run a Top Fuel or Pro Stock club. PLEASE don't ever let it become some sort of private domain for a bunch of Prima Donna's like some racing has become!!! Leave it wide open like it is so that Joe Average has a chance to go Pro!!!!! No reason to fix a system that isn't broken!!!!

Theres some truth to your words Dave.

BUT, saying that alky car experience has no advantage over no experience? Well you're never gonna convince me of that.


As far as keeping the 'exclusivity' away from pro racing, how do you figure that having no experience but lots of money helps that?

We'll just have to agree to disagree.

Dave that's exactly what I meant to say before I said what I said. ..... Neff said.

Oh, those pro cars. They practically drive themselves. Nuttin' 2 it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9O0b90G8Yhg