Thread: E85 VS. Premium fuel

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E85 i am told is 105 octane ethanol corn fuel, basicaly moonshine with something added to keep you from drinking it. i am told by random people that the performance is better with the E85 then 93 or 95 octane petroleum based fuel. is there any truth to this statement?

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Moon, go to the av gas thread.......there's a little more info there. Any questions after that, just ask. There too many people here that can answer what you're curious about.

We run it in a couple of drag cars and my shop truck. Both the drag cars are big block Ford's and run in the 9's. Switching from race fuel to E-85 required going up two jet sizes in the primaries and 3 in the secondaries. This year we started adding E-100 to the pump E-85 and "brew up" a batch of E-90. Octane is now 107.

On my shop truck, the stock fuel line is still working fine after a year's time on E-85. I did have to change the fuel filter a few times after the initial changeover. Most all the newer carb and injection gaskets work just fine on E-85. I have a friend who does a lot of these changeovers in his shop so he set this truck up as well as did the chassis dyno tuning on both drag cars.

Performance is better with the E-85 then with pump gas, and with my proximity to so many ethanol plants in this area and the fact that it is currently $.47/gal. less then regular gas it works great for me. Besides, it's my contribution to lowering our dependance on imported oil. Guess I'd rather see my fuel dollars stay here then go to some foreigner who allready has too much money.... I know it won't solve any world problems, but it's something positive that I can do, anyway....

I would love to run E-85 in my el camino, I think it would make it perform so much better without sacrificing drivability, however, I'm not aware of any stations here that sell E-85. I live in Lawton, Oklahoma 73505. If anyone knows, or can tell me how to find out if there is one in my area I would much appreciate it. Thanks!

Originally Posted by Hopper111

I would love to run E-85 in my el camino, I think it would make it perform so much better without sacrificing drivability, however, I'm not aware of any stations here that sell E-85. I live in Lawton, Oklahoma 73505. If anyone knows, or can tell me how to find out if there is one in my area I would much appreciate it. Thanks!

Around here, I just go on the computer and check for area stations that handle it. We're getting more locations all the time. Should be making it to your area eventually.

Sounds like E85 would suit my 34 quite well especially since it likes to gobble up the 93 octane stuff like it was liquid candy. Only downside is that I have yet to find any stations carrying it in my area. It seems as if we are the last to get everything.

we wont ever see it out here in cali, E-85 breaks down too quickly for it to be shipped out here and then distributed to stations..... as well as it also has increased hydrocarbon levels compared to gasoline, since we're the smog law state, we wont be selling it ... but we do have some of the top research going on for hydrogen fuels going on right here in san diego.... so not all hope is gone yet.... i still say we drill in alaska and open up one of the largest untapped oil supply's in the world.... oil prices would drop very drastically, and we could keep it for ourselves

Sals, Don't take this wrong, but the developement of E-85 is growing because the public wants it. We have developed a couple of retail stations here in Phx and 4 more will be up by late summer. I don't like the stuff either, but politics demands that we run around like sheep and moan about the mid-eastern oil companys etc. Venezuela has our wallets tied up right now. So things are not as they seem. My "Paying" job as a contractor for Valero and Excel Energy is for hydrogen fuel resources. I am with you on this. There are so many up-start problems we are face because of the deterioration of the components we can use affordably. We will get this down. Unfortunately, we are a way off to achieve this problem's solution. Yeah, we can transport the stuff with the same "loss" as petroleum based stuff, especially if it's piped. I am also with you in opening the reserves up in Alaska etc. Until we get our favorite sons out of office that have created the political rhetoric, We have to stay diligent in finding "our" solutions to make our rides the best they can be. Stay diligent in your quest for answers becuase it looks like it's going to be the Hot Rod community that is going to have the answers eventually. Thanks for the insight to what you're going thru over there.

I wish there were E85 stations here in Ny, but there is not, there are 2 stations in NYC, both of which, are goverment only stations, there are 2 stations in Albany set up for it, but the goverment hasn't 'cleared' them to pump it yet... it's been about a year so far.

Here we go again. There's a solid reason, well more than one really, why E85 would be cheaper.............it contains less energy! See the linked chart for comparisons of most common fuels used for transportation; http://www.nafa.org/Content/Navigati...quivalents.htm

You'll note that a gallon of E85 has almost 1/3 less energy content than a gallon of gasoline. That means that without changing the hardware (and in modern cars the computer software) you'll get approx. 1/3 less work out of it. If it's only around 10% less expensive, using the example sited, then you're actually paying MORE in useable energy cost. This is part of why you have to jet up when you switch to E85 if you want to optimize it's use. Also, the higher octane will allow you to tune to a higher level. Net net you may be able to increase your thermal efficiency a few percent, but it's unlikely you'll improve enough to get beyond 75-80% as much output as from a gallon of gasoline, so E85 still should be priced at that level to just break even with gasoline for REAL cost (excluding the cost of modifications to use it). For more reasons why ethanol fuels are more expensive in REAL cost than gasoline see the next paragraph, there's a more detailed discussion in the link. In addition to what was true then as now, we've now had the heavy hand of government distort the demand market for ethanol by mandate so that now it is crowding out the corn used for food production. As such this artificially driven demand has increased the cost of feed for meat production, cereal products, food fillers, corndog coatings, and more food products than you can imagine unless you like to read the fine print on the side of packaged foods. So, higher grocery prices are a result of increased ethanol use, yeah, you're paying at the store for that "cheaper" fuel that you may not even be buying(except for the 10% mandated oxygenate)!

Three years ago I addressed most of the issues involved in a thread called "No Free Lunch"; http://www.clubhotrod.com/forums/sho...ght=free+lunch
This will only be of interest to those who are willing to explore the issues involved in our fuel picture. If you'd rather be mesmerized by media hype or popular culture mythology it will be an honest inconvenient truth for you. Keep in mind that some of the pricing and profit data are three years old, so have changed, but the fundamentals are still viable.

I see that hydrogen fuel is brought up again. I asked the other day in the Avgas thread for you all to consider the feed stock for hydrogen fuel. If you've read the the "No Free Lunch" thread by now, you understand my point. If you're not interested enough to read that then I'd love to continue the discussion here. Where do we get the hydrogen?

Yup, I remember all that. Thing is, it still has higher octane, cost less per gallon, and works great in 500 horse engines....

Don't know much about the rest of it, just know that it works for me..... Doubt it will solve any world problems, but it sure does solve mine of race gas at $7.00 a gallon and it comes out of a pump and tank, not a 55 gal drum that I have to store someplace...

yup might work for that dave.... but it sure does screw up the economy..... no one is better at knowing how to spend your money than the government....

I stumbled across a Shell station out by the interstate the other day that has an E-85 pump and a 110 octane "racing fuel" pump. I don't know what the E-85 is going for, but the 110 is (or was) priced at $4.50 Gal. Based on what I hear people buying drums of race gas for, $4.50 sounds very cheap by comparison. Am I not comparing apples to apples? Is the stuff in the drums the same fuel?

Don't know what he has in his tank, but I suppose it's a lot cheaper when they bring it in a tanker vs. putting it in drums?????