Thread: What do you think of this kit?

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My 302 Ford block is at the machine shop right now getting the standard stuff, line bored, decked, hot tank, cam bearings, bored 30 over, etc. I figure while I am building it I might as well go with more cubes so I'm looking at stroker kits to either go to 325 or 347 cubes (probably 347). What do you guys who build engines think of this kit?

ESP" Full competition rotating assemblies are the perfect choice for racers desiring a bullet proof bottom end peformance engine.

New Eagle 4340 forged steel crankshaft
New Eagle "ESP" 3-D H-Beam connecting rods ( Bushed Fit Pins )
New SRP high performance forged aluminum pistons, with pins and locks
Premium Plasma moly performance piston ring set
Clevite 77 high performance H series performance rod and main bearing set


Crankshaft Stroke Rod Length Piston Type Piston Brand Compression Ratio 58cc Compression Ratio 62cc
3.180 5.400 Flat Top -5cc
SRP Forged 10.3 9.8

I'm also thinking about these aluminum heads from ProComp:

Aluminum Cylinder Heads Feature-

Hardened Seats
Bronze Valve Guides
High Grade Aluminum
Multi-Angle Seat Design
Available Complete or Bare
Available fully CNC Machined
Designed Performance Valve Springs
Advanced Port Design for Greater Flow
Combustion Chamber: 60cc
Intake Runner: 210cc
Intake Valve: 2.02"
Exhaust Valve: 1.60"
Spring Pressure Closed: 140 lbs. @ 1.800"
Spring Pressure Open: 325 lbs. @ 1.225"
Retainer Material: Steel
Valve Seal Material: Viton
Valve Guide Material: Manganese Bronze
Valve Job: 3-angle


Do you guys like this combo? If not what changes would you make? I'm going to run either a MotorSport X or Z cam with it.........stick shift, deep gears, maybe 4:33 or 4:88 and a 30 inch tire. Probably roller rockers, not sure of brand yet, maybe Comp Cams.

Thanks,

Don

I didn't see where it say's that it is balanced, I've heard in the past that some Eagle cranks can take alot of work to balance. $$$

Ron

On another forum I frequent, Eagle stuff has a bad name from the professional engine builders. Here are two direct quotes that are representative of the mindset of builders......

"quality issues they can have makes it not worth me buying from them anymore."
Keith
K-Star Automotive Performance Engines

"I send 90% of my Eagle cranks out to be turned because of journal sizing and geometry problems. I have also had several that had undersized snouts. Scat cranks are almost always to my liking, with no problems."
Machine Shop Tom
Professional engine builder

Keith doesn't much like the ProComp heads either......
"They are good for a stock rebuild, or to say you have aluminum heads. I have had 2 sets through my shop. They will be the only 2 sets i ever sell... If you want a head that makes power you are out of luck..."
Keith
K-Star Automotive Performance Engines

well i would and have used scat crank and rods or compstar / callies crank and rods and use the SRP pistons . the canfield heads or other like afr dart thats old news on the small size on the crank snouts and i seen many get turn to fit better .thats is why i never used them .i have used many scats .i do not know how many .but i know how many i sent back over the years one set of rods for bad threads in one .and a bad finsh on the crank for a sbc blower engine

Interesting. Looks like I might have to shop for some other stuff. Not looking for a monster motor, just something a step up from a decent 302 build.

Thanks for the input so far guys.


Don

Ok, how about these World Product heads?

TECHNICAL SPECS

Casting ID Number: I-058
Material: High density cast iron
Valve Seats: Intake (integral), exhaust (hardened)
Valve Guides: Integral cast iron
Spring Seats: Machined for 1.560" and 1.250"
Valves: Manley stainless steel valves in assemblies (inconel exhaust valves on marine applications)
Valve Diameter: 1.940" intake, 1.600" exhaust (11/32" stem)
Guide Plates: Special World part #830460-8
Rocker Arm Studs: Screw-in style
Rocker Arms: Adjustable rockers recommended. 1.6 ratio (use of 1.73 ratio will require elongation of pushrod holes)
Intake Runner: Standard port location
Exhaust Ports: Standard location (dual exhaust bolt pattern to accommodate large custom headers)
Spark Plug: 14mm 5/8" .460" reach tapered style
Valve Job: Multi-angle intake and radiused exhaust
Valve Cover Rail: Raised
Valve Angle: Stock 20°
Accessory Bolt Holes: Stock
50-State Emissions legal

Spring Specs
1.250": 100 lbs. @ 1.810", 300 lbs. @ 1.250", coil bind @ 1.200", max lift @ .570"
1.437": 125 lbs. @ 1.810", 340 lbs. @ 1.210", coil bind @ 1.160", max lift @ .600"
1.550": 200 lbs. @ 1.900", 480 lbs. @ 1.200", coil bind @ 1.150", max lift @ .700"

Head Flow
JR. @ .600 lift: 236 (intake), 169 (exhaust)

WINDSOR JR. Iron Heads
WINDSOR JR. Iron Heads

Don

I also have a set of 68-ish 302 heads that have had a little work done to them, but I figure what I will spend to get a good valve job on them could go toward something better.

call competition products and ask about the heads they have on the broom sheet they have some pro toplines .buy a scat cast steel crank I beam rods good pistons srp or mahle pistons . run a hyd roller cam and save some money..your only going to make so much HP before looking for a better block. well that how i see it anyways

I've got a set of Comp Products Topline heads that I bought off their broom sheet a number of years back. Got them on the 'Horse, great heads!!! Got a heck of a deal on them, all CNC flowed, Manley valves, etc. They work great, and haven't had a bit of problem with them in a bit over 6,000 miles of ummmm, "intense" street use!!!!


As for the rest of the block pieces, I'd personally be spending a few more bucks and getting a bit higher quality shaft and rods.... Comp Products runs some super specials from time to time on their Howard's cranks, rods, and kits....

Originally Posted by Itoldyouso

Not looking for a monster motor

Come on now Don, with deep gears and a stick, YOU KNOW you want a playtoy and I KNOW you want a playtoy. Fess up.

If there's one thing I've learned through all the years I've been playin' with this stuff, it is that the power is in the cylinder heads more than any other one component in the motor. I'll 'Sim the World heads for you, but first, allow me to ruin you with some really good heads.....

347 Ford, 4.030" x 3.400" with 5.400" rods and flat-top pistons.
Scat 93023 CAST STEEL crankshaft
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SCA-93023/
Scat 25400912 forged I-beam rods
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SCA-25400912/
SRP 140689 forged pistons, 5cc eyebrows
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SRP-140689/
Trick Flow TFS-51494030-040 head gaskets, 0.040" compressed thickness.

Cut block deck height to 8.200" for zero piston deck height with the above components. Deck finish of 50 RA or finer for use with Trick Flow head gaskets, installed dry. 0.040" gaskets with zero deck will yield squish of 0.040".

Trick Flow TFS-51400010-CO1 aluminum cylinder heads. 2.02"/1.600", 185cc intake runners, 66cc exhaust runners, max valve lift 0.600".
http://www.trickflow.com/partdetail....1&autoview=sku

Edelbrock RPM or Weiand Stealth intake. High-rise, dual-plane with 750 double pumper of your choice.

CompCams 31-609-5 solid flat tappet cam, 1.6:1 rockers
http://www.compcams.com/Cam_Specs/Ca...?csid=827&sb=0

Full length headers, 1 3/4" primaries.

Static compression ratio 10.23:1 no matter what any other charts say.
Dynamic compression ratio with components used, 8.11:1
Volumetric Efficiency 101.0% @5500
Max BMEP 214.0 @5000

RPM HP TQ
2000 120 316
2500 155 325
3000 200 351
3500 265 398
4000 336 441
4500 404 472
5000 462 485
5500 501 478
6000 528 462
6500 545 441
7000 540 405
7500 534 374
8000 514 338

Don, World doesn't publish flow figures, so I can't Sim them. So, let's ease back on the wallet and use a set of Racing Head Service cast iron heads with 180cc intake runners....
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-35301-01/

And we'll pull back on the cam one notch to make a little more torque on the bottom and also to coordinate with the lift limit on these heads....
http://www.compcams.com/Cam_Specs/Ca...?csid=826&sb=0

RPM HP TQ
2000 128 336
2500 165 346
3000 215 376
3500 280 420
4000 346 454
4500 410 478
5000 466 489
5500 499 477
6000 518 454
6500 528 426
7000 520 390
7500 506 354
8000 475 312
Volumetric Efficiency 98.7% @5000
Max BMEP 212.7 @5000

I see that RHS fudges a little by using a 4.200" bore pipe to flow the heads, so you may want to figure back on the 'Sim numbers a little. But heck, even if you factor the numbers by .90, that's still 475 hp and 440 ft/lbs and that's certainly nothing to sneeze at. Just so you know, the TFS flow numbers were arrived at with a 4.030" bore pipe.

Yeah, I can't go nuts on the money spent on this project as I have only about 2.5 months to get it running and have a lot of other stuff to buy for the rest of the car (I'm redoing my 27 for the Billetproof Drags Oct 25th) so a lot of money will be going for parts for the car itself and some upgrades. I figured while I was freshening up the motor anyway I should consider adding some cubes and better heads. But it looks like the parts that would make any real difference are also costly.

The Drags aren't really a true competitive event, just a chance for everyday guys to run cars down the strip than normally wouldn't get the chance, so I don't need to build this thing for all out power. Maybe just some good 30 over pistons, some decent rods, a drilled stock crank, and my early heads rebuilt will be all that I can swing between now and then. Plus I have to buy a new 9 inch center section, upgraded SFI flywheel and clutch setup, slicks, etc, etc, etc.

I guess the old saying " Speed costs money, how fast do you want to go?" still holds true.

Don