Thread: Grand National Roadster Show

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[QUOTE=Itoldyouso]

What did you guys think of this car? I think it is really sharp. Jay, just out of curiousity, what would a paint job like this cost, I mean on the frame, suspension, and all?

Don

Don, Great looking car! The cost?.....As they say...."It depends".

There are so many variables that it's hard to say. Is it "show quality", "street & show quality", how straight is it?.....or do I need a drum of bondo? Is there already paint on it? How much? Is it failing?, metal or 'glass work to be done?, etc, etc.

Something like this would probably be $2500 and up, plus materials.

You Guys should check the pictures on the HAMB. Ken posted over 600
and there is more there also. IMO Rick Dorns 36 or Johns 36 from
Canada should have won. They were first class. I liked the old Dragsters
but I did enjoy the Suede Palace the most. Ken, your Truck looked great.
Ron

I sort of understand what you mean about how the judges think Ken. One time about 10 years ago a local show promoter asked me to be one of 3 Judges at a show he was putting on............I thought "why not?" I was a minor Judge because the main guy had a lot of experience judging 100 point cars at serious events. It was really a learning experience for me to watch how he did it and what his thinking process was.

We would walk up to a car and he would ask "ok, what do you see?" and I would comment on some nice aspects of the car. He, on the other hand, would find flaws. "The doors don't fit well, the color is badly matched, etc" There was one car that was a trailered in, high dollar, show only car. I couldn't find one flaw on it, but he did. I felt like a blind man compared to what he was able to find. I ended up being the clipboard carrier.

I would guess the Judges you witnessed are looking at the cars in a different way than we are. They obviously leave their own likes and dislikes at the door, and vote on other aspects.

Don

hmmmm. How many of you have ever looked at one of the judging sheets for these big shows? Taste, style, traditional or not, gaudy paint, nice paint, flames, scallops, graphics, or multi-hues really has nothing to do with who wins. Cars are judged on an objective basis... The important things like fit, finish, and detail count, not whims, fads, or passing fancy..... It doesn't matter if the wheels are 23" or 13", what counts is the overall appearance of the wheel, the shine it has, no nicks, dings, dents, scrapes or any other form of blemish. It's also not about trailer queens vs. drivers.... In this judging a flaw as blatant as a rock chip will guarantee you a spot waaaaay out of the top 10!!!!!

If you want the results of what car is the best of the follow the leader crowd, then look to see who get's the People's Choice or Ladies Choice!!!! The stuff in the suede tent won't get the Best Engineered, Best of Show, or the coveted Riddler or America's Most Beautiful Roadster Trophy.....

The roadster that won the AMBR trophy is an exercise in engineering and a display of talent that according to a team of judges and an OBJECTIVE judging sheet scored the highest total points based on how it was built and how all the various components were finished, painted, plated or whatever and the fact that they were installed very carefully with no nicks or scratches from errant wrenches leaving a mark.... It's not a popularity of leader or the fad contest, those are held in parking lots across the country!!!!!!

Recognize these cars and the people who build them for what they are, the BEST of the BEST and not one of the artsy, subjective, fad following, trick of the month club cars that many think should win........

BTW---anybody know who won the "Best Injun Blanket Seat Cover" trophy out in the "suede tent"??????? Is "suede tent" some new politically correct term for rat rods, or what??????

From the pictures I have seen of the cars in the Suede Palace, they are far from rat rods. Most of them any of us would be thrilled to own.

Don

Originally Posted by kennyd

i know BOB did so post them .

No kenny, I didn't go, but I did just get this in the mail..............


http://www.photoshow.net/watch/SC3xB3rX

Dave- You are right, these guys had tiny telescopic mirrors. These things were beyond perfect. In the beginning of the show, the roadster that won, had the roof on. But the next day it was laying on the turn table. I wonder why they took it off?
Ken

Originally Posted by Ken Thurm

Dave- You are right, these guys had tiny telescopic mirrors. These things were beyond perfect. In the beginning of the show, the roadster that won, had the roof on. But the next day it was laying on the turn table. I wonder why they took it off?
Ken

and small little flashlights with LED bulbs, too I'll bet!!!! Many years ago we showed a '34 3 window in the winter series of ISCA shows. Average time to detail and clean the car was about 30 hours, then another 10 hours after you got the car unloaded and set up in the display area!!!! People can say what they want about trailer queens, but they should also realize that the build time for a show quality car is about 3 times that of a driver, then add to this the prep times I mentioned.... Is it worth it? One each "Best of Show" and "Best Engineered" created enough new business to keep a 2 man Hot Rod Shop busy for 4 years!!!!

I guess, like anything else, don't knock it 'til you've tried it!!!!!

Right Ken??????

Originally Posted by Itoldyouso

From the pictures I have seen of the cars in the Suede Palace, they are far from rat rods. Most of them any of us would be thrilled to own.

Don

Don - You are right, there was some cars in there that were beyond kool. And I would bet they were home built.
Now I hope you guys take this the way I mean it. I don't think my truck is a slouch by any means, and it didn't win anything. I was hoping to win a trophy but after walking around on Thursday I didn't think I had a chance in hell! I talked to several of these guys and every one of them was amazed at what showed up. For me I will never forget this show, it was that cool. It sure would of been cool to take a trophy home from the Grand National Roadster Show!!
Ken

Originally Posted by Dave Severson

and small little flashlights with LED bulbs, too I'll bet!!!! Many years ago we showed a '34 3 window in the winter series of ISCA shows. Average time to detail and clean the car was about 30 hours, then another 10 hours after you got the car unloaded and set up in the display area!!!! People can say what they want about trailer queens, but they should also realize that the build time for a show quality car is about 3 times that of a driver, then add to this the prep times I mentioned.... Is it worth it? One each "Best of Show" and "Best Engineered" created enough new business to keep a 2 man Hot Rod Shop busy for 4 years!!!!

I guess, like anything else, don't knock it 'til you've tried it!!!!!

Right Ken??????

Yep, do you know how long it takes to clean a frame with scotch bright and WD40? I tore that thing apart and cleaned it and painted it and cleaned and polished until I didn't have any fingerprints left. But you know what? It was worth every hour spent building that thing. To stand there and listen to people notice the smallest details that you worked real hard on makes it all worth it to me. I love that little truck, I can't even imagine what it would be like to build a contender for that show.
Ken

Originally Posted by Ken Thurm

Yep, do you know how long it takes to clean a frame with scotch bright and WD40? I tore that thing apart and cleaned it and painted it and cleaned and polished until I didn't have any fingerprints left. But you know what? It was worth every hour spent building that thing. To stand there and listen to people notice the smallest details that you worked real hard on makes it all worth it to me. I love that little truck, I can't even imagine what it would be like to build a contender for that show.
Ken

Yes, I know exactly what you mean!!!!!! I've got a couple more business involvements to shake loose of, then I'm thinking I might have one or two more show cars left in me.... One is a roadster, but I doubt nor dare to even dream that it would be the caliber of the AMBR contenders but more to the ISCA level of competition..... It's just getting so dang expensive to build anything anymore.... Just finished ordering some moly plate for the 4 bar mounts on the 'maro and an 8' stick of 1.125 moly round tubing for some experimenting with a new A-Arm design and killed a hundred dollar bill----- Some rough calculations for my roadster and my projected cost for materials to build a chassis with brackets and suspension is already North of $5,000.00!!!!!!! But yes, you're right....it's worth every cent!!!!!!

[QUOTE=HOTRODPAINT]Don, those comments were not pointed at anyone on this site. You guys are real gentlemen compared to other sites!

I have quit a couple of them, due to the rudeness. I think what bothers me the most is that it is tolerated by their moderators.]


No intent here to side-track a good thread, but you're absolutely right, Jay. People here are much more civilized.

On another site I mentioned that I once had a very strong running Corvair Corsa with, among many other things, a four barrel. Some guy responded with "Scuse me, but Corsas came with four single throat carbs, not four barrels". Then another hammerhead chimed in with "obviously he (meaning me) don't know WTF he's talking about". (I interpreted this comment to mean that I had somehow strayed from the true course of rectitude).

Well, dang it, I know that. When I got the car the engine was disassembled and piled in the back seat. The whole intake system, including carburetors, was missing, so I bought a "spider" four barrel intake manifold from Clifford.

Then, on the same site, some young guy who was in the process of building up a Chrysler 413 from a motor home asked if there is anything different or unique about the motor home engine. Well, there are several differences, some of which make them unsuitable for extensive modification, so I listed them.

Then a guy jumps in the middle of me for discouraging the boy by telling him what he was attempting to do couldn't be done when he was well on the way to doing it. HUH?

Who was it that squawked at me? THE MODERATOR!

Apologies for sticking in this rant where it maybe shouldn't be.


Jim

Ken don't feel bad about not trophying, everyone on here knows your truck is a winner, both visually and engineering-wise. I've taken my T to two shows (aside from Turkey Run) and haven't trophied either, and that is ok. I tossed out a bunch of trophies that I won with my '27 when we moved our shop, because they were a pain to keep dusted.

Dan and I have talked about it. The cars that win are generally not what you or I would build for ourselves. We see it at show after show, the cars that win are done up so gaudy with over the top elements that I wouldn't want to own them. This isn't always true, but more often than not. Plus, shows are getting more attendance all the time, so it is hard to stand out in a crowd of 1000 or 2000 other cars.

What I really enjoy is what you mentioned Ken, the comments of other rodders who take the time to get down on their knees and take in all the little stuff you have done to your rod. I have had some very nice (sometimes embarrasingly so) comments from people who are nice enough to tell you how much they like your car. It is so much fun when someone asks you how you did some little aspect of the car, and/or tells you they are going to copy that on theirs. I;ve even seen one guy with a video camera running it all along the underside of my T, shooting up under the frame and floor.

As for People's Choice, that becomes a mixed bag too. The things the general public see as cool are usually the things we rodders snicker at. I have heard civilians make some of the strangest remarks about cars and the things that catch their attention (Oh look Harry, they have stuffed animals even in the trunk!! )

I also like cruises better than shows. You don't have to spend 8 hours in the sun and you can BS with lots of like-minded people in a more relaxed atmosphere.

Don

[QUOTE=Big Tracks]

Originally Posted by HOTRODPAINT

Apologies for sticking in this rant where it maybe shouldn't be.


Jim

Since you're the eldest member of the site some babbling is allowed............we understand.

Well, I didn't sleep to well last night. I kept thinking about all the post in this thread and all the people who respond on this site. I'm going to try and respond more to treads, not that my input will help anyone more but just the friendships that develop from this place is amazing.
I can't wait for next years show, wait till those white glove, mirror laden judges see my new roadster!
Don, you are right on, the camaraderie in this sport and actually using these vehicles is the real fun.
I think I'm going to take a nap.
Ken