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Originally Posted by Bob Parmenter

Atlas Shrugged is iconic for freedom lovers, even those who aren't uber-Libertarians in full embrace of Ayn Rand. Like Roger I read the book in the early '60s for the first time. If not taken literally it's very predictive as well as historical.

Some suggestions for those yet to read that will make it easier to consume. First, reading the long version can be daunting because of size, though it's a reasonably well crafted story. About 3/4 of the way through John Galt launches off into a speech that ends up at 100 pages give or take depending on the printing size. If you don't have the gist of the book by then the speech won't convince you anyway.........my recommendation is skip the speech and finish the story...........makes the book more easily digested.

For those wishing a shorter version (what we used to call the Reader's Digest version) there's something called Sparknotes, it's called a study guide and is a reasonable good condensation of the story line: Sparnotes.com You lose some of the lore of the full novel, but it might fit a tight schedule better.

I'd forgotten that the Galt speech goes for so many pages, Bob, and like Dave says, my old paperback version is the 6pt type print and it's still over 1000 pages - a good read, but long and Uncle Bob's suggestion is a good one. I agree 100% - it cannot be taken literally, but the predictive nature of it is a bit shocking.

the problem with the left is they won't come right and shoot or stab capitalism they they use the rain drop reasoning ( no single rain drop will admit to causing the flood ) but they all add up don't they.....ted

Bob the first time I read it was in 1985, and yes I did skip the monologue! Ayn Rand was a very gifted and foward thinking writer, that wrote words of social criticism in a way everyone could understand. I also read Fountainhead by her, can't remember which one I liked better, it was so long ago, now.

Getting away from Atlas Shrugged, here's a little tidbit I picked up today. Obama has thrown his budget out for "consideration", which I'm guessing will be one more ho -hum, 365 day add on to the already thousand days (Jan 23) the USA hasn't had one.

This is about the Chevy Volt and similar expensive doodads:

"The White House intends to increase taxpayer-funded subsidies for those who purchase new-technology vehicles to $10,000 per buyer, up from $7,500. Keep in mind that the average income of a Volt buyer is $175,000 per year. That means that middle-class taxpayers are helping the rich buy pricy, politically correct cars."

Since I believe that most of us are firmly in the middle class by definition, am appalled that I have to help contribute to that farce of an automobile so the tree huggers and bunny lovers can say they've 'helped'. Of course, what they seem to forget (if they ever knew) is that if we move our transportation away from fossil fuels, we have to put additional loads on our already aging infrastructure - power plants (which mostly use fossil fuels to make power), the ancient power grid that breaks with increasing regularity nowadays, pipelines ..... all transferred from one visible fossil fueled source to others that are hidden, but still there

Just for you Dave.....

This whole economy thing is approaching the absurd!!!! I've yet to hear anyone with any kind of reasonable solution, certainly not the current power structure in Washington.... The Volt did create new, good paying jobs at the new plant it was built in, but at what cost??? First we bail out GM, now we give a huge tax credit (rebate), those are some very expensive jobs we created, huh??

We know who the Democrats will run for President this year, and I sure haven't seen much of a worthwhile offering from the Republican party, either!!!! Got to wonder if maybe this is the year that the voters are so fed up with both parties and their inability to do anything worthwhile that an Independent could actually become President???? It would certainly serve as one huge wake-up call to both parties to get their act together and actually do things that are good for the majority of people in this country for a change!!!! I just don't see much good coming out of the 2012 elections unless people will actually wake up to the fact that the status quo in government doesn't work and it's time to vote into office some real people who have the good of the country as a priority.... Doubt that will happen either. And, as usual, everybody blames the President for everything that's wrong and forgets about the idiots pushing the legislation through Congress.

Everybody is so good and so busy at the blame game these days they don't seem to have time to come up with a workable solution to the problems that have this country so messed up!!!! Isn't there anything or anyone left in this country with anything positive to present, or is too late and nothing left to do but wait for the total collapse of the economy???

Dave stock up on sheetmetal so you have somthing to do. lol I realy think or at least hope the people know that the president is miore a token than a person to get things done....What He needs to do is blow the whistle on the dumd a__ in congress let people know who is and is not doing there job name names. he can't do anything anyway. I AM NOT SAYING I LIKE THIS GUY BUT WE ARE STUCK WITH HIM. I agree I have yet to see anyone at the plate that I would vote for. Maybe we should elect Our Senior Geezer for pres. Or you ,,,you want the job , I'd like the pay and pension along with the bennies. I know I don't have the answers we've gotten so screwed up oner the years letting the government do things there way passing bills inside of bills just to sneak them in...then no one in congress reading them befoe they pass them...I know I don't sign anything with out reading it. We have a bunch of butt heads runing this place and its falling apart all around us because WE let it

Ron paul...

Originally Posted by gassersrule_196

Ron paul...

Now that doddering old isolationist/Libertarian is frightening - especially when he has to bring his own entourage to a state's caucus to 'win' votes

Like many of my peers around me, A LOT of them are going "underground", that is, they take under the table jobs or become "self-employed" at jobs/carreers that constantly lose money, then jump onto the public dole and actually live almost better than I do considering they don't have to work but a mere pitance the hours that I do!

X2 on Ron Paul, it'll be better than writing in Mickey Mouse again!

The dems & repubs are a mirror of each other, they both stink! I already lived under Romney and he is a SNAKE! What he says and what he'll do are 2 very different things! Just look at "our" mandated healthcare.. It's a farce! Just a place to give political jobs to persons who know nothing except create more paper work and mandate fines / bills!

A lot of younger folks don't vote because it's become a FARCE! Out votes mean nothing! It's been said before, a little revolution can be a good thing!

you dont vote....... you dont get to bitch .
ron paul is about 70% good ideas and 30% bat shit crazy .if he's loose the 30% he would have been president long ago.
i have closed my business . no more 3% ppt , no more paper work for the state . i will simply build a car and sell it. let the dmv collect the taxes.

The only way we will change things is to get lots of $$$$$ and buy our own congressman and/or senator

what you do is give each one of them 1 term to make changes. if not fire their ass and replace them. first change needs to be an end to retirement for them. let them draw ss like the rest of us.

Originally Posted by 53 Willys

The only way we will change things is to get lots of $$$$$ and buy our own congressman and/or senator

The way NY State is being redistricted, you might just get a chance to do that. Unfortunately we will still have Schumer and Gillibrand as senators, but the new congressional lines aren't done yet as NY will lose two based on the 2010 census . Then the state assembly and senate are also up for grabs as we in Saratoga County have lost both current dummies and will for sure have a better assemblyman with the senator an unknown quality to me but well liked where he is currently.

And again Ron Paul - Shine, I'll go 50-50. Unfortunately we need someone who is at least 80/20 or, better 90/10.

If I'm elected president, I will drive my own car, fly my own plane, my wife can fix me breakfast----

Annex Cental America all the way down to Columbia--We'll get the Panama CAnal back, build a fence between Panama and Columbia--
Consider a joint deal to accept Canada's provinces as states

ID chip/card and drug test everybody, identify who/what/where the drug traffic is to get rid of the drug cartels---

Schools will have new class schedules--spelling, reading, writing(English will be the system, not a course) welding, machining, electronics, carpentry, plumbing, truck driving, cooking (home and resturant/bakery) mechanics(auto/truck repair and industrial),road building, forestry, etc----- there will be less effort spent on suppling people to the NATIONAL football, basketball, baseball leaques(National will mean our Olympic teams)

Start a national project to redo our ports, and construct a new heavy system for connecting cities and ports to get the big trucks on there own system--


My First(and ONLY) lady is saying breakfast is ready----