Thread: The Spyder Slays a Dragon

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Made it back from our road trip to Tennessee and Georgia. We had a really good time and the car did mostly good. However, there was some bad and little downright ugly. As usual, I’ll break this into several posts.

First, the good stuff. This was a weeklong trip that took us first to a little town in Tennessee named Townsend. This is near Pigeon Forge. Since we weren’t much interested in the tourist trap stuff in PF, we opted to stay out of the hustle and traffic. Nearly everything we wanted to do was easily accessed from Townsend and we spent two days there.

On the trip up, I surprised my wife with a stop in Fort Payne, Alabama at the Alabama country music group museum. She is a country music fan and had mentioned that she would like to stop one of these days. Well, that was now and she was genuinely surprised, I think.



I planned the trip in 150–160-mile fuel stop “legs” and that was just about right before needing to stretch our legs. We had a nice steak at the steak house that was within walking distance from our hotel in Townsend.

Our first day of activities was a long one and we managed to cram several things into it and got a neat bonus that I wasn’t expecting. We made about a 225-mile loop that took us along the river road in Wears Valley over to 441. This highway runs over the mountain to Cherokee, NC, but we turned off on the Blue Ridge Parkway just before Cherokee. Here is the car at the Newfound Gap overlook near the top of the mountain. It’s all down hill from here!



We got off the Blue Ridge near Maggie Valley, NC and visited the Wheels Through Time antique motorcycle museum. This museum is a must see for anyone with even a passing interest in old two-wheeled iron. There are around 300 motorcycles there and nearly every one of them runs. Some are restored and some are “as found” but preserved. The staff cranks them up at times for visitors to hear. Some are even regularly ridden. There used to be a show called” What’s in the Barn” that featured the original museums owner Dale Walksler and his son Matt. Sadly, Dale has passed away, but Matt still runs the place and carries on his father’s legacy. I have visited many times over the years and always stop in when I’m in the area. Every time I’m there, I find something new. I have had conversations with both Dale and Matt and found them to be very personable folks that are passionate about preserving running examples of old American iron.

As an example. I once read an article about a fellow that rode a 1912 Henderson 4-cylinder motorcycle around the world in 1912. He was the first person known to accomplish this feat. On my next visit to the museum, I ran into Matt and asked if they had a 1912 Henderson. He said they didn’t have a 1912, but they had a 1913 which was exactly the same. He led me to it, talked about it for a while and then asked if I wanted to hear it run. Of course, I said yes. He proceeded to fire it up, but frowned and said it was running bad. He told me to wait while he went in the back. When he returned, he had a new set of sparkplugs and a wrench and proceeded to change the plugs right on the spot. After that, the old bike quite literally purred like a kitten. Super smooth. That’s the kind of place it is. No velvet ropes. It even has that wonderful smell of old motorcycles if you know what I mean. Gas, oil, and rubber. Perfume to a gear head.

This is that very same 1913 Henderson, except now it’s on a pedestal. Still runs though.



That Henderson four-cylinder engine eventually morphed, after a lot of improvements, into the vaunted Indian Four, like this one. My grandfather was said to have had one of these with a sidecar. He had polio in one leg as a child and so the side hack was required, but I still have a hard time figuring out just how he operated the tank-shift transmission, the foot clutch and foot brake given his bad leg. It would be a “bucket list” item for me to own one of these. That will most likely never happen, but I can dream!



Not everything at the museum is two wheeled. They cranked this dirt track car while I was there but didn’t get to it in time to record it.





This is the Traub motorcycle that was found sealed up in a walled-off room in a Chicago brownstone that was being demolished. It is the only example known to exist and almost nothing is known about it or its origin. It has been dated to the teens by some of the equipment that it has. It is speculated to be some kind of prototype that was never in production. According to the museum staff, it would easily have been the most advanced motorcycle of its day. At least a decade or more advanced than anything by any other American manufacturer, maybe even the world. Doesn’t look extraordinary compared to the other bikes in the museum but has very advanced features compared to its contemporaries. Was once owned by Steve McQueen and his stuntman. That alone makes it cool in my book. It runs.



For the last several years, they have been raffling off an antique motorcycle every year to raise funds for the museum. The giveaway bikes are usually built on-site and are always very cool bikes. This is this year’s candidate, which I believe is a 1937 Knucklehead bobber. I bought some tickets, but just consider it my donation to help keep this marvelous place going. I would probably pass out if I actually won but would be one happy man for sure. Who wouldn’t be?



This Harley race bike sits just inside the entrance to the museum.

A bucket list stop for me. I've actually planned this trip 2 or 3 times but life "happened" and I haven't made it yet. 8-( But I'll get there eventually! The one trip I did make that was kinda like your trip here was when I went to see the Speedy Bill collection ( of Speedway Fame ) it was just fabulous too!

Originally Posted by 34_40

.......The one trip I did make that was kinda like your trip here was when I went to see the Speedy Bill collection ( of Speedway Fame ) it was just fabulous too!

That one is on my bucket list if I ever get to Lincoln. I've seen some very interesting bits about Bill's collection.

Wow, I'm in awe every time I see a show or pics of this motorcycle collection/museum. So much cool history. A lot of the motorcycle museums in our area are dying off. That's crazy about that Traub and how it was found. I've never been into motorcycles because my dad was in a horrible motorcycle vs car wreck before I was born so powered 2 wheel units were forbid when I was growing up. The wife's dad had a similar deal so she hates them too. I've got a lot of friends that are into motorcycles and I've really had the hankering to build a cool old knuckle head or shovel. I like shiny and bikes are easier to hoard.

Great accounting of the museum experience Mike (not to be confused with the "other Mike" ). That's some nifty hardware there.

That midget engine looks to be a '32 Ford with an overhead conversion. Maybe a cross flow Cragar without the valve cover? Love it!

You mentioned McQueen's stunt man, likely that was Bud Ekins, once a big time bike racer in addition to other accomplishments. His notoriety in the bike world got him a Southern California Honda motorcycle franchise in the very early '60s when they entered the US market. That name recognition thing at work......

The creativity in the motorcycle world was not a back seat endeavor. I recall some 40 plus years ago having the chance to visit the shed of a gentleman named Dean Spencer, in the Seattle area. He owned a company called Spencer Aviation, sold parts for all manner of aircraft. His passion was vintage vehicles of all sorts. In addition to a Duesenberg, Pierce Arrow, some Packards and such, he also had some bikes. The one he had that most caught my attention was up in a loft since it hadn't been refurbished or restored. Dean had a second level passion for steam powerd vehicles, which included the usual Stanley as well as a couple Dobles. And yes, the bike I referred to above was steam powered from back in the day. CRS keeps me from being positive, but I believe it was a White, a company that also made four wheel cars during the first decade of the twentieth century. History is a kick.........

Bob, I went to the original picture and blew it up to read the plaque that described it. I had to degrade the picture I posted so that it wouldn't cover half the page. There is no mention of Cragar making the head and I didn't see Cragar cast anywhere that I could see. There did not appear to have any provision for a valve cover either since there was no rail at all to contain the oil, but that doesn't mean one couldn't be fitted somehow. It did say that the carbs were Winfield's and that it was a B model Ford.

Yes that was Bud Ekins that owned the Traub. I think he had it first and then sold it to McQueen. CRS kept his name out of my head until you wrote it.

Here is an interesting story that has recently came out about the Traub. Seems the mystery may be mostly solved.

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Awesome thread, thanks for sharing. Out of curiosity, is that old Alabama tour bus still sitting in the parking lot? My Wife and I went there years ago.
Nolan

I don't remember seeing a tour bus and neither does my wife.

Every so often you get a nice surprise. A little bit of serendipity that comes out of the blue.

After we left the museum, we wanted a little snack to tide use over until we could get a nice meal in Pigeon Forge later. We stopped at a little convenience store for a bag of chips and maybe some beef jerky (love the stuff). The Healey always seems to draw some lookers and as we were leaving a fellow came up to strike up a conversation. I have chosen to respect his privacy and won't give out his name. I doubt he wants a lot of people pestering him and after the story, you will see why.

He recognized the Healey as actually a Sebring kit car and said he had owned a couple. He then proceeded to tell me about the original Healey’s he owned as well as long list (very long list) of other cars. Said he had them in barns, several barns.

After a few minutes, he asked which direction we were going. When I told him, he said follow me if you have the time. One of my barns is on your way. We were a little pressed for time, but something told me to make it happen and I’m very glad I did.

My friends, this one barn was a gear head’s paradise and looked like something right off the American Pickers show. It might have been one of their stops in reality. It was packed, with very little room to move, but I was greeted by things like a cut away Triumph motorcycle engine, bicycles from the 1800’s and an old midget race car. There were some rare and very valuable cars too. XKE’s and the like. All in “barn find” condition, but there none the less. He even had an old NASCAR racer that was driven by a well known driver.





The field that surrounded this barn was full of things like 55, 56 and 57 Chevys and even a Lamborghini bulldozer. Yes, a Lamborghini bulldozer! Bet you won’t find that just anywhere.

The Lamborghini logo is tough to see in the pictures, but it is there!



Sadly, we really were short on time and had to press on, but I could have wandered around with him for hours just drooling over these “treasures” he had collected. Of course, I asked if anything was for sale since I really would like to have an antique motorcycle to tinker with, but he told me that while he did have some, he is a collector, not generally a seller. So be it, I’ve seen the type before and it’s not my place to judge. Still, I considered myself privileged to have seen a small portion of his collection. Wish I could go back and see the rest!

Sounds like it was a fun tour! I'm with you on the mixed feelings when nothing is for sale. In one place in particular that I drive by every day, over the last 30 yrs I've watched nice cars turn into powder.

Wow, just wow!

It's surprising how often that type of story can repeat. Similarly met a guy at a strip mall car gathering many moons ago who talked about his "collection". He returned awhile later and invited my buddy and me to his place nearby. Long, long story short, he had three rows of dilapidated chicken coops stuffed with automotive stuff he'd collected. I counted 105 cars and saw a bunch of parts.

You may have to go back there for a longer visit.

After the “Pickers” stop, we headed over to our main goal for the day. Driving the infamous “Tail of the Dragon”. For those that don’t know, the Dragon is an 11 mile stretch of US129 that runs from Deal’s Gap in North Carolina into Tennessee. Most of it is in TN. The publicity hypes it as “318 curves in 11 miles”. Is that true? Don’t know, but it IS a bunch of curves and I do like curvy roads. Way back in the 90’s, it was a place few people knew about, other than the ones that drove it all the time, but at some point, it became a “motorcycle” road. Then the real hype kicked in, businesses were built, and it became famous. People come from all over the country and yes, even the world to ride or drive this little stretch of country road. At one time, it was pretty much an open road with very little traffic and very little law enforcement. That has changed on both fronts. Today, it’s a very busy little country road, especially on the weekends. Then it’s absolute insanity. We were there late on a Monday and it wasn’t bad, but there is rarely a time with no tourist traffic.

There aren’t many country roads that have names for nearly every curve or section. Names like The Whip, Gravity Cavity, Crud Corner, The Dips, Brake or Bust Bend and Shaw Grave Gap. You can draw your on conclusions on that last one. The store at Deal’s Gap has a Tree of Shame that is covered with parts that are the detritus of the many and frequent motorcycle wrecks that happen. It has become a road to test your mettle on and sadly, sometimes, the exuberance exceeds the skill set of those that feel compelled to go for it, but such is the hype that has become the Tail of the Dragon.

Even law enforcement has unwittingly contributed to both its fame and infamy. By talking constantly about how dangerous it is, they have thrown down the gauntlet of challenge for many, many riders and drivers, while others just want to see what all the hype is about. Professional photographers set up at several locations and take action pictures of just about every vehicle that passes by (more of those Dragon businesses). These are sold online and make some of the most unique car related souvenirs, IMO. These guys are very, very good at framing action shots on the fly since they get more practice in a day, every day, than most photographers will get in a lifetime.

I’ve ridden or driven the Dragon somewhere around 18 times over the years, so I guess I have fallen for the hype, too. Most of those times were when I was with a motorcycle group and the daily rides were preplanned. There always seemed to be someone that hadn’t been on it and wanted to give it a go. To be honest, I’ve made wrong turns in the Pigeon Forge area and accidentally found roads as good or maybe better than the Dragon. There is one in particular that I wish I could remember! I’m sure the locals know many better roads but keep them secret for fear they will turn into the next Dragon and become too busy to have fun on. If there is one thing that keeps me coming back, it’s the photographers. Most folks will never have a professionally done action shot of their car and it has become a personal thing for me to collect them of my various toys. Otherwise, I would have no regrets skipping it in favor of some other “road less traveled”.

These are some of my pictures.







I have an in-car through-the-windshield GoPro video, too, but doubt I will put it up. It’s not that I’m afraid of getting a ticket, quite the contrary. My average speed worked out to be around 30 MPH. The posted speed limit is 30. My video looks very slow because it was and doesn’t come close to the thrill I felt. That’s the beauty of a low-slung go-kart like car. Even 30 feels fast on a curvy road like this one. I doubt anyone wants to watch a 20-minute video of me appearing to just drive around curves. To put my speed into perspective, the only “unofficial” world record I could find is about 18 minutes from the overlook to the crossroads at Deal’s Gap and back to the overlook (2-way trip). That average speed was over 50 and was set in the 90’s when it was, for all intents, an open road. Try that now and you would get pretty much the same results playing Russian Roulette with 5 in the gun. Also, the number one rule for the Dragon is “Stay in your lane”. It is a public highway with an abnormally high volume of traffic. Try using “all the road” and “cutting a tight apex” and you will soon be sporting some form of 2-wheeled hood ornament. And, there is nowhere on the Dragon that you would want to take an unplanned off-road excursion. You typically have your choice of a rock wall or a tree-filled 50–90-foot ravine. Given the choice, I think I would take my chances with the rock wall. At least with the wall, gravity ain’t giving me any help.

Mike, you reminded me of a funny story about low slung sports cars. I had a 1963 1/2 Triumph TR4A when I was in high school. My late friend, Terry, was reminiscing some years ago about riding in that car over the speed limit.
He said that car sat so low and the seats were so flat on the floorboard, you could feel rocks coming off the road hitting you in the ass. LOL
Nolan

Nolan, I've had that same sensation riding in C2 and C3 Corvettes. Felt like I was just before sliding on the road.

On a side note, I think the car needs more roll stiffness. There is a little more body roll than I would like. It’s pretty obvious in the pictures, although I will say the camber gain in the front appears to be mostly keeping up with the body roll. The outside front tire looks to be pretty much vertical to the road. It might help if I added a little more static camber, but that might cause tire wear. As it is now, the car “feels” pretty neutral to me. There are times when it has a tiny amount of understeer and other times when it feels like a little oversteer. Mostly though, it seemed to go where I pointed it without any drama.



I want to experiment with a rear bar, since the one I had built during construction interfered with the body and I had to ditch it. I could increase the front roll stiffness, but that would probably induce understeer. I’ll wait until I can build a new rear bar before tinkering with the front. The car is definitely driving good now. I just want to make it better. That, to me, is what hot rodding is all about.

I had an issue with one of the Mickey Thompson SR’s that were on the car right before we left on this trip. The right front developed a bad flat spot and refused to “round out” again. MT’s are kind of hard to get and pricey. I previously had trouble with one of the rear tires not wanting to seal on the rim and had another one that had developed a slow rim leak. Nope, ain’t starting on a long trip like that.

The only tires I could get locally on short notice were Cooper Cobra’s. I was leery of them since the Cobra guys generally don’t say good things about them, but I guess the extra weight of this car, compared to a Cobra, helped. They performed good for me, and I definitely put them to the test on the Dragon as to handling.

We made 3 one way passes that day. I had to wait for the oil to cool off before the last pass. It was up to 240 before we made it back to the store at Deal’s Gap. That tells me that an oil cooler will be required if I ever do a track day with the car. Most of the time during normal driving the oil temp runs about 10 degrees over water temp or less. That is exactly what my Hemi powered Ram truck does. In fact, on cold days, the car struggles to get the oil up to water temp. An oil cooler would probably have to either have a thermostat or be covered most of the time. Not sure one would be worth the trouble for the limited number of times I would actually need it.