Thread: '38 Ford deck lid vs 37 Ford deck lid

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Randy - going to be tough to pull that complete inner framework as a unit without causing even more problems. While it might be spot welded to the lapped over inner side skin, that weld wont go through to the outer skin surface. Spot weld cutters use a center drill to locate and hold the tool in place and a separate cutter to mill the actual spot weld off. This of course leaves a fresh new hole to fill - and you still haven't been able to pull the skin off of the frame. You will then have to pry that outer skin off of the frame, possibly (most likely!!) distorting it - and a further problem trying to straighten twisted and probably stretched outer skin metal.

I think I would approach it in sections rather then as a whole. Where you want to make a repair, using your die grinder and a carbide bit (or a reduced diameter cut off disc) grind those spot welds then cut the actual inner framework at that area and carefully pry it out, distorting as little outer skin as possible. This leaves only that smaller selected area for repair, you then can MIG that smaller piece of removed framework back in place and reducing the amount of visible area that was repaired inside and minimal finish work outside. More time consuming - but at this point, it only amounts to a few hours (on top of even more "few hours")

Originally Posted by IC2

Randy - You will then have to pry that outer skin off of the frame, possibly (most likely!!) distorting it - and a further problem trying to straighten twisted and probably stretched outer skin metal.

More time consuming - but at this point, it only amounts to a few hours (on top of even more "few hours")

Hey Dave, good thoughts in your post but I'm more of a "gentle persuasion" guy than the "bull in a china closet" guy. If the sledge hammer comes out it will be because I will have come to the conclusion that it's just not worth it and I need the satisfaction of making sure of that!!

Thanks for the responses, guys! The only place the "skin" overlaps the framework is on the bottom lip. The rest just appears to be spot welded every 3 or 4 inches.
I found a website where this guy is doing the same thing. There are other helpful pics for any of you guys working on 37's too. Stellar Antique Auto Restorations 1937 Ford Restoration

For example, here's the top edge of my "new" lid. You can see where the inner & outer are tacked together every few inches.
IMAG1292_1.jpg

Here are a couple of pics I swiped from the website above. Apparently, the framework can come out it one piece
removingframe2.jpg

In this primed pic, you can see where he apparently drilled out the spot welds along the edge.
repairedframe.jpg

Since this is a "restoration" he's going to install factory style insulation between the frame & lid. It looks like he may have repaired all the spot weld divots from the previous pic.
frameout.jpg

I'm wondering if he glued the frame back in instead of welding?
reunitingframe.jpg

Sounds and Looks like that Stellar site has it down pat!

It's been said that a sledge hammer in my hands is really just a finish hammer for me....

Originally Posted by 34_40

It's been said that a sledge hammer in my hands is really just a finish hammer for me....

Yeah, Mike, the sledge is the one I use if I really want to finish it....once and for all! It might end up being a good remedy for these trunk lids!

So here's what I did today: In this first pic just below that wavy deck lid (which is the culprit that started this whole mess! Why couldn't I just be happy pretending that thick layer of bondo wasn't really there!!) you'll see a pretty smooth tailpan. Ah, but I remembered that it wasn't pristine either when we built this car the first time, so I figured I better strip it down to see what sins I had committed in my youth.
IMAG1194_1_1.jpg

No, I didn't take the sledge hammer to this!! After grinding off the bondo treatment, I was surprised to learn that this is the original tailpan. I thought we had fabbed one from a 65 Mustang deck lid but apparently that was on the 39 Ford I used to have. I just got confused. Anyway, it looks to be rust free but it is beat all to hell. Should I try to straighten it out or cut it out and replace it with a new one??
IMAG0019_1.jpg

I bolted on my old lid to check things out....
IMAG0021_1.jpg

Then bolted on the "new" lid. Both lids have fitment issues for sure.
IMAG0023_1.jpg

I decided to go ahead and take the "new" lid apart and assess the damage. Given the way this thing was spot welded, I don't think a spot weld cutter would have worked too well. I used a thin putty knife to separate the two pieces a bit then used the tiny cut off wheel on my Dremel to cut the weld. Some of them just broke with a slight amount of force.
IMAG0029_1.jpg

So, here they are separated. One of the lower corners needs some patching because of rust-thru and there are 3 or 4 small rust holes near the handle area. I still need to strip the skim coat of bondo off the top side to see if there are more surprises lurking there. I know there are a few dents close to the top of the lid that were filled with bondo because there is no access to knock them out with the frame work in place.
IMAG0030_1.jpg

Now, where's that sledge hammer??!!

That's a whole lot better way to work that deck lid, Randy, impossible to do it right without taking it apart. The tail pan is pretty tough, could be smoothed out but IMO replacement would be a lot better deal....

Originally Posted by Dave Severson

That's a whole lot better way to work that deck lid, Randy, impossible to do it right without taking it apart. The tail pan is pretty tough, could be smoothed out but IMO replacement would be a lot better deal....

I hear ya, Dave, but that stuff isn't cheap. The tail pan is $285 and if I replace the floor extension/tool compartment, that's another $245!! It's probably the only way to get it right though.....

Wow, that's some expensive sheetmetal!! Depending on what tools and equipment you have access to, could build the tail pan.....not anything simple but it could be done. I'm just too tight to pay the high prices for the repop stuff so I've had to learn to build a lot of pieces....

Originally Posted by Dave Severson

Wow, that's some expensive sheetmetal!! Depending on what tools and equipment you have access to, could build the tail pan.....not anything simple but it could be done. I'm just too tight to pay the high prices for the repop stuff so I've had to learn to build a lot of pieces....

I'm tight, too, plus I can't really afford it! There are a couple of braces on each side of the tailpan. If I remove those, I can have access to most of the panel from the inside. I think I'll see what I can do with that first. I need to get some better body hammers, though. Any kind that you recommend??

I have a couple of Martin's, they're really nice and an old set of Snap-on hammers that I've had for better then 20 years! Having a set of good, well balanced hammers makes all the difference in the world!

Originally Posted by Dave Severson

I have a couple of Martin's, they're really nice and an old set of Snap-on hammers that I've had for better then 20 years! Having a set of good, well balanced hammers makes all the difference in the world!

Do you know which Martins you have? I have a cheapy hammer & dolly set. the dollies are fine but the hammers suck.

Randy - are those the EMS prices for the body panels? WOW !!!

I've seen Martin's selling new at swap meets fairly reasonably - but still in the $30 range. Whichever hammer(s) you end up with, I think you will prefer the hickory handle rather then fiberglass. I had one with a 'glass handle and sold it, replacing it with the wood. It just didn't 'feel' right - but then I sold the the '31 sedan body and really haven't been used much since.

Originally Posted by IC2

Randy - are those the EMS prices for the body panels? WOW !!!

I've seen Martin's selling new at swap meets fairly reasonably - but still in the $30 range. Whichever hammer(s) you end up with, I think you will prefer the hickory handle rather then fiberglass. I had one with a 'glass handle and sold it, replacing it with the wood. It just didn't 'feel' right - but then I sold the the '31 sedan body and really haven't been used much since.

Yeah, Dave, those EMS panels sold thru Hotrod Sheetmetal 1937-40 Ford Sheet Metal Argh!!

Will do some shopping for appropriate hammer/s. I got some hammerin' to do!

Originally Posted by randyr

Yeah, Dave, those EMS panels sold thru Hotrod Sheetmetal 1937-40 Ford Sheet Metal Argh!!

Will do some shopping for appropriate hammer/s. I got some hammerin' to do!

I found it amusing that you folks are naming your hammers... I've got 3 sizes of ball pein, and 3 sizes of sledge hammers.. oh and a couple framing hammers and a new upholstery brad setting hammer..

Randy, I'll be living vicariously (sic?) through you on this phase of the project!

OH, ALMOST forgot... pictures please? I'm learning and need pics!