Thread: '38 Ford deck lid vs 37 Ford deck lid

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Originally Posted by 40FordDeluxe

Did you pay the guy through Paypal? You should be able to file a claim on him for it. especially seeing how it's not near how he described it. Any way, can you use the inner structure from this rusty one, and the outer skin from yours and make one?

Hey Ryan, unfortunately, I didn't pay him with Paypal. I mailed him a check. He doesn't like Paypal. Now I think I know why!

As for using the inner structure on my old one, that won't really work. One of the reasons I decided to get another lid instead of fixing my old one is because of the way my lid was repaired many years ago. The inner structure was welded in with too much heat, etc and now it's very solid but also very wavy. My dad & I were learning back then. I'm still learning! Anyway, I had a fairly thick coat of bondo on the lower portion of the old lid, which smoothed it out ok but I was trying to avoid that this time.
I'll sand the "new" lid down to bare metal to see what I really have then make some decisions from there.

In the meantime, I think I'll send some of these pics to the seller and see if I can guilt him into refunding some of my money!

Thanks for your suggestions!

Check Ford Barn and see if they have a feedback Forum . Maybe at least spread his name out some .

Originally Posted by bluestang67

Check Ford Barn and see if they have a feedback Forum . Maybe at least spread his name out some .

I thought about that Bobby, but I hate to do that kinda stuff. On the other hand, if he's doing the same thing to others, he needs to be exposed. I'll check it out....

Randy he just totally misrepresented his add spread it like peanut butter . If not stab him in another add he puts up .


Randy I know this wasn't the intent but you could cut out a section that is the right radius and make a patch . A little work but replacing instead of saving metal .

So, I sent these pics to the seller expressing my disappointment with the lid. He refunded $100 of my money. I appreciated that!

Now, anybody got any advice on the best way to take this thing apart?? The inner framework appears to be spot welded to the edges of the lid. Doesn't look like drilling them out is a good idea. Maybe run a narrow cutoff tool down between the two surfaces at the weld points?? I would appreciate any thoughts....

Thanks.
Randy

Randy, when you say "drill them out" do you mean using a spot weld cutter? They have a drill bit, but also have a "stop" to limit the travel through 1 side. Here's Summit's offering Spot Weld Cutting Tools - Tools & Shop Equipment - SummitRacing.com

Randy, good to hear that you recieved some "refund"... and I'm the furthest thing from a body guy but, how about drilling right through the spot welds? it'll leave a hole to fill but it's gotta be easier than trying to pry and open the joint enough for a cutoff disc. Does the edge of the lid "skin" overlap and pinch onto the sub-frame?

Maybe do the lid repairs in quarters (or eigths) to help keep things straighter? Like I said, I'm no body man, just some thoughts is all..

(That's the same tool as I was thinking of! Thanks RSpears!)

Randy - going to be tough to pull that complete inner framework as a unit without causing even more problems. While it might be spot welded to the lapped over inner side skin, that weld wont go through to the outer skin surface. Spot weld cutters use a center drill to locate and hold the tool in place and a separate cutter to mill the actual spot weld off. This of course leaves a fresh new hole to fill - and you still haven't been able to pull the skin off of the frame. You will then have to pry that outer skin off of the frame, possibly (most likely!!) distorting it - and a further problem trying to straighten twisted and probably stretched outer skin metal.

I think I would approach it in sections rather then as a whole. Where you want to make a repair, using your die grinder and a carbide bit (or a reduced diameter cut off disc) grind those spot welds then cut the actual inner framework at that area and carefully pry it out, distorting as little outer skin as possible. This leaves only that smaller selected area for repair, you then can MIG that smaller piece of removed framework back in place and reducing the amount of visible area that was repaired inside and minimal finish work outside. More time consuming - but at this point, it only amounts to a few hours (on top of even more "few hours")

Thanks for the responses, guys! The only place the "skin" overlaps the framework is on the bottom lip. The rest just appears to be spot welded every 3 or 4 inches.
I found a website where this guy is doing the same thing. There are other helpful pics for any of you guys working on 37's too. Stellar Antique Auto Restorations 1937 Ford Restoration

For example, here's the top edge of my "new" lid. You can see where the inner & outer are tacked together every few inches.
IMAG1292_1.jpg

Here are a couple of pics I swiped from the website above. Apparently, the framework can come out it one piece
removingframe2.jpg

In this primed pic, you can see where he apparently drilled out the spot welds along the edge.
repairedframe.jpg

Since this is a "restoration" he's going to install factory style insulation between the frame & lid. It looks like he may have repaired all the spot weld divots from the previous pic.
frameout.jpg

I'm wondering if he glued the frame back in instead of welding?
reunitingframe.jpg

Originally Posted by IC2

Randy - You will then have to pry that outer skin off of the frame, possibly (most likely!!) distorting it - and a further problem trying to straighten twisted and probably stretched outer skin metal.

More time consuming - but at this point, it only amounts to a few hours (on top of even more "few hours")

Hey Dave, good thoughts in your post but I'm more of a "gentle persuasion" guy than the "bull in a china closet" guy. If the sledge hammer comes out it will be because I will have come to the conclusion that it's just not worth it and I need the satisfaction of making sure of that!!

Sounds and Looks like that Stellar site has it down pat!

It's been said that a sledge hammer in my hands is really just a finish hammer for me....

Originally Posted by 34_40

It's been said that a sledge hammer in my hands is really just a finish hammer for me....

Yeah, Mike, the sledge is the one I use if I really want to finish it....once and for all! It might end up being a good remedy for these trunk lids!

So here's what I did today: In this first pic just below that wavy deck lid (which is the culprit that started this whole mess! Why couldn't I just be happy pretending that thick layer of bondo wasn't really there!!) you'll see a pretty smooth tailpan. Ah, but I remembered that it wasn't pristine either when we built this car the first time, so I figured I better strip it down to see what sins I had committed in my youth.
IMAG1194_1_1.jpg

No, I didn't take the sledge hammer to this!! After grinding off the bondo treatment, I was surprised to learn that this is the original tailpan. I thought we had fabbed one from a 65 Mustang deck lid but apparently that was on the 39 Ford I used to have. I just got confused. Anyway, it looks to be rust free but it is beat all to hell. Should I try to straighten it out or cut it out and replace it with a new one??
IMAG0019_1.jpg

I bolted on my old lid to check things out....
IMAG0021_1.jpg

Then bolted on the "new" lid. Both lids have fitment issues for sure.
IMAG0023_1.jpg

I decided to go ahead and take the "new" lid apart and assess the damage. Given the way this thing was spot welded, I don't think a spot weld cutter would have worked too well. I used a thin putty knife to separate the two pieces a bit then used the tiny cut off wheel on my Dremel to cut the weld. Some of them just broke with a slight amount of force.
IMAG0029_1.jpg

So, here they are separated. One of the lower corners needs some patching because of rust-thru and there are 3 or 4 small rust holes near the handle area. I still need to strip the skim coat of bondo off the top side to see if there are more surprises lurking there. I know there are a few dents close to the top of the lid that were filled with bondo because there is no access to knock them out with the frame work in place.
IMAG0030_1.jpg

Now, where's that sledge hammer??!!

That's a whole lot better way to work that deck lid, Randy, impossible to do it right without taking it apart. The tail pan is pretty tough, could be smoothed out but IMO replacement would be a lot better deal....

Originally Posted by Dave Severson

That's a whole lot better way to work that deck lid, Randy, impossible to do it right without taking it apart. The tail pan is pretty tough, could be smoothed out but IMO replacement would be a lot better deal....

I hear ya, Dave, but that stuff isn't cheap. The tail pan is $285 and if I replace the floor extension/tool compartment, that's another $245!! It's probably the only way to get it right though.....