Thread: Everybody that is currently building a car...

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the one in there now is a 1983, what yr. are you replacing it with? you said you were gonna change that one out.

lt1s10, I'm going to keep it and just add amber turn signals to the rear; probably amber LEDs from Speedway in the form of 5/16" round "dots" in the bottom corners of the body. I may use them in the front too with just a simple metal right angle under the edge of the front fenders. One guy suggested using the Mr. Roadster lights down low bolted through one of the holes on the front bumper brackets but that seems behind the bumper to me. He did say that such an arrangement would light up the whole underside of the front fender at night, but I think that mount would be too low behind a bumper. You said you like a lot of lights and I considered Pontiac round lights on the rear of the body in addition to the Model A "stalks" but I think the little round LEDs will keep the car looking more original (RestoRod, remember) and the LEDs are really bright. Another possibility is to actually set up a pattern of 5 LEDs on each side in the shape of an arrow. The dots are cheap so maybe an "arrow" arrangement would be neat and yet flat on the back of the body? The patterns could be something simple like an arrowhead. On the one hand any departure from "standard" fifties equipment like Pontiac rounds, '40 Ford Chevrons, Chevie lights or the favorite '39 Ford tailights will look "strange" but the LED dots are only 5/16" diameter and very bright so I think I can have my RestoRod look with Model A stalks&teacups and still be legal with just one LED dot down in the corner of the rear panel on each side. Anybody else worked with these LED "dots" ? I know the LEDs tend to put out a straight beam of light that might not be visible over a wide angle. Can anyone else comment on the use of LED "dots" ?

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

DennyW, thanks, that's neat. It looks like the 50% cone would extend maybe +/- 35 degrees on each side for a total angle of 70 degrees to the rear. I think I will try using the amber LEDs and if they don't pass inspection I can add a few more nearby. I am aware that there is some controversy about LED tail lights as to how far they can be seen from the side; I wonder if 35 degrees to the side is enough? I'll have to think about this a bit and I have time since there are some other things to do first. Thanks.

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

DennyW, thanks for the sources. I am aware that maybe one LED is not enough for State Inspection so I will study the links you have provided. I recently found one definition of "vermillion" which contains Mercury instead of Cadmium.

Cinnabar is naturally-occurring mercuric sulfide (HgS), while vermillion is the name given to the red pigment derived from either natural or manufactured cinnabar.

Thanks for the info, the good part is that with a flat display I can just drill a few 5/16" diameter holes and push the LEDs into the holes.

Here is an amber LED that is pretty large without any "cup" but it has a rubber backing, maybe something like this could be attached directly to a flat surface like the rear of a Model A roadster/coupe? Just bouncing around the Internet.

http://www.wiringproducts.com/?target=dept_106.html

Of course there is a kit to put LEDs in the Model A teacup housing but that brings up the problem of using the stoplight for a turn signal again.


Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

Originally Posted by Don Shillady

lt1s10, I'm going to keep it and just add amber turn signals to the rear; probably amber LEDs from Speedway in the form of 5/16" round "dots" in the bottom corners of the body. I may use them in the front too with just a simple metal right angle under the edge of the front fenders. One guy suggested using the Mr. Roadster lights down low bolted through one of the holes on the front bumper brackets but that seems behind the bumper to me. He did say that such an arrangement would light up the whole underside of the front fender at night, but I think that mount would be too low behind a bumper. You said you like a lot of lights and I considered Pontiac round lights on the rear of the body in addition to the Model A "stalks" but I think the little round LEDs will keep the car looking more original (RestoRod, remember) and the LEDs are really bright. Another possibility is to actually set up a pattern of 5 LEDs on each side in the shape of an arrow. The dots are cheap so maybe an "arrow" arrangement would be neat and yet flat on the back of the body? The patterns could be something simple like an arrowhead. On the one hand any departure from "standard" fifties equipment like Pontiac rounds, '40 Ford Chevrons, Chevie lights or the favorite '39 Ford tailights will look "strange" but the LED dots are only 5/16" diameter and very bright so I think I can have my RestoRod look with Model A stalks&teacups and still be legal with just one LED dot down in the corner of the rear panel on each side. Anybody else worked with these LED "dots" ? I know the LEDs tend to put out a straight beam of light that might not be visible over a wide angle. Can anyone else comment on the use of LED "dots" ?

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

thats sounds like the way to go. far as I know if it don't have D.O.T/S.A.E stamped on the lens it won't pass in VA. thats for led or reg. lights.

lt1s10, that's an important point! It really helps to have you experienced guys online; especially from the same state!

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

Originally Posted by Don Shillady

lt1s10, that's an important point! It really helps to have you experienced guys online; especially from the same state!

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

i just hate to see you put something on the car that you are going to have to change.

lt1s10, I found this on a biker Forum; I'm learning all the time. Amber front, red rear, for turn signals. This was from a biker with a handle of "Bison" and it is probably true for roadsters as well as bikes. The question remains the same as what Bison says, what about the angular visibility of those LED replacement bulbs that are less than $10 in the Speedway catalog? The diagram DennyW found shows about 70 degrees width for 50% visibility so the multi-LED bulb replacements should be OK? A lot of new cars have the LED bulbs with 19 or so LED tiny bulbs embedded in the plastic and the Speedway 911-31020 red and 911-31021 amber do have the multi-LED surfaces, so I guess it's a good idea to ask folk on this Forum, like yourself, what small lights can be added to the front and rear of a roadster with fenders that are DOT approved (amber front, red rear)? Hey, that is why this Forum is so great because we can collect info from a LOT of experienced folks.

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder


Registered User
Bison
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Van Is
Sportbike: 98GL B$ you spend the $$$$ here is what they must be so that the Cops will not bother you..

Turn signal devices
4.13 (1) A vehicle may be equipped and mounted with

(a) a lamp type turn signal system, or

(b) a semaphore turn signal device,

functionally equivalent to original equipment supplied by the vehicle manufacturer or of a type or make approved by the director.

(2) A lamp type turn signal system must

(a) have 2 lamps, mounted on the front of the vehicle, that are capable of displaying flashes of white or amber light which are visible to the front,

(b) have 2 lamps, mounted on the rear of the vehicle, that are capable of displaying flashes of red or amber light which are visible to the rear,

(c) be visible on each side of the vehicle at a distance of 100 m in normal sunlight at an angle of 45° from the longitudinal axis of the vehicle, and

(d) include a tell-tale lamp which gives a clear indication that the system is activated.

(3) During the time specified in section 4.01, a semaphore turn signal device must be capable of illumination by light or reflection visible from a distance of 100 m.

because of th e way LEDs function (brightest when viewed from straight on) I can see problems with meeting section (C) ..and they are likely not "functionally equivalent to original equipment supplied by the vehicle manufacturer ". (B) I wouldn't want to make it harder to see my turn signals when the idiots out there in cars can't seem to see the brighter fully legal ones now!

Just a thought, courtesy lights from any '68 Mopar. The round ones were only used in '68 and I have seen them used on rods. They came in two different styles, flat and peaked in the middle.

all I know is I had a parts store, repair shop, st. insp. station all in one building at 3201 w. broad for a few yrs, and the st. police came in the shop one day to buy something, and saw some cheap non DOT approved 3rd. brake light that I sold in the store, and he got mad as hell and told me I could either give up my st. insp. station or get rid of those cheap 3rd. brake lights, as a st. inspector I should have know better ,and he didn't want to see that junk on his road. that was the last time I sold a light that didn't say DOT.
just something that happened to me, may not apply to you at all.

Thanks lt1s10, that's a good point to remember. I need to do more research on this problem, but I have already learned a lot! Apparently amber on both front and rear would be OK as long as the devices are DOT approved.

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

lt1s10, Here is a link to a site with turn signals for Model A restorers. This particular one is for LEDs with no mention of DOT approval but there is also a bulb version available from Brattons in Md. which is about half the price and would not require LED circuitry. Also this requires no cutting or drilling of my new paint job. I did not really want this type of turn signal but they do hide the wire underneath the bumper bracket pretty well. Look at the height of that '30 Model A, now I know why I got a dropped axle! Maybe this is the way out; I want to check with Brattons since they are nearby in MD. they should be familiar with whether these lights will pass inspection in VA and whether they are DOT approved. I looked at several lights in Auto Zone today and there are quite a few LED lights available without DOT on them and they looked to be from a Eurpoean mfgr. Some of them were for turn signals but they were very large. There was a neat set of LED "beehive" amber lights but no hint as to DOT approved design and they were listed as only for running lights. Well maybe I will just get the bumper lights with a bulb if I can find out if they will pass inspection in VA. Click on the picture with the license plate and check out how well the wire is hidden.

http://www.logolites.com/led/turn/signals/index.htm

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

Originally Posted by Don Shillady

lt1s10, Here is a link to a site with turn signals for Model A restorers. This particular one is for LEDs with no mention of DOT approval but there is also a bulb version available from Brattons in Md. which is about half the price and would not require LED circuitry. Also this requires no cutting or drilling of my new paint job. I did not really want this type of turn signal but they do hide the wire underneath the bumper bracket pretty well. Look at the height of that '30 Model A, now I know why I got a dropped axle! Maybe this is the way out; I want to check with Brattons since they are nearby in MD. they should be familiar with whether these lights will pass inspection in VA and whether they are DOT approved. I looked at several lights in Auto Zone today and there are quite a few LED lights available without DOT on them and they looked to be from a Eurpoean mfgr. Some of them were for turn signals but they were very large. There was a neat set of LED "beehive" amber lights but no hint as to DOT approved design and they were listed as only for running lights. Well maybe I will just get the bumper lights with a bulb if I can find out if they will pass inspection in VA. Click on the picture with the license plate and check out how well the wire is hidden.

http://www.logolites.com/led/turn/signals/index.htm

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

they have turn signal lights also, would look good. I emailed them and ask if they would pass a DOT insp. hope ypu don't mind, i'll let you know what they say.

Helpppp!!!
I hope I am not over my head in my project. I bought a 51 Chevy 3/4 ton and my son and I plan on rebuilding it. So far we have removed the chrome, front sheet metal and doors. We can't decide on removing the cab as we understand it is quite a job. We do want to strip the frame and remove all paint and rust. We also want to install a small block v8. We also want to install disk brakes and power steering.
I have been told a mustang II front end would work. Would something else be better or easier to find?
At this point we are afraid to do much more, not knowing the best path.
Also, which is best to remove rust etc., a chemical dip, sandblasting, plastic beads, or what?
I apologize for the large dump of questions.
jb

Hello and welcome to CHR
You may as well take the cab off I have done several of these and I beleave there are only 4 more bolts to go. It makes things much easier. I have used subframes on the ones I did, but the mustang IFS will work. On mine I strip off every thing I can from the frame and have it sand blasted the body parts are not as heavy a metal they cane be striped I just sand mine down with 60 or 80 grit and a DA or body file, then make repairs and prime. You will want to rewire it to 12 volts. One good thing all the glass is flat so its easy to get new. Door and window seals are available. You may or maynot want to relocate the gas tank to the rear between the frame rails or in the bed. Your choice of rearends is limitless justabout anything can be used. Good luck on your project and post some pictures if you can. There are many guys here that can and will help.
Charlie