Thread: mustangII CONVERSION KIT

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WHAT BRAND OF MUSTANGII CONVERSION KIT FOR INDEPENDENT FRONT SUSPENSION WORKs THE BEST?

STOP YELLING and tell us what application.

Abe

sorry iam new at this,no more capital letters. application is for 1936 chevy pickup,street rod

I have been using Heitds who makes excellent products. I recently came across Lakeshore Fab at last yrs Turkey rod run & bought upper & lower control arms from them. They looked like a copy of Heitds but, were cheaper: www.lakeshorefab.com
Don

Are you wanting to get the best vs budget or DIY? There are other options besides MII.

Frank,
I think that the first question is:
Do you want the rack and pinion to be on the front side or on the back side of the crossmember?
If it doesn't look good on the front side on your '36 you cannot use the original MII spindles or the original rack and pinion.
I have original MII front clip but I have never installed any of them so this was all that I know about them.


Jani

I prefer the subframes from Fatman Fabrications. They have some that use GM "G"? Body components (Nova parts) that I think will work better on a heavy ride.

Using a stock Nova (Apollo, Lemans, Omega) subframe is too wide for a pre-50's ride. Fatmans subframe is narrow but it uses the heavier duty parts.

Have you ever driven a Mustang II with a V8??? Not a good ride at all

I've been building & driving cars w/Must II front suspensions for more yrs than I like to think about. I also have used Jaguar(E-type)Camaro,Volare,Dodge Dakoda,Chevelle,Pete& Jakes...etc.

I think if they are set-up correctly ,have the proper spring rate & are aligned correctly the ride is close in all of them w/the exception of the jag which in a 32 Ford cabro had a slight advantage.......Fatman thru the yrs has not been a favorite of mine however, I have not used Fat man products lately.
As far as Nova/camaro subframe being too wide I have narrowed them a small amount w/success......Don.

I don't know if we'll ever here from FRANK again, but it doesn't matter. Others read these threads and glean info from them so I can't hold back any more.

Mad, I gotta deal with your comments first. Let me qualify by saying I've had cars with both a Nova (etc.) front, and a MII. I had a Nova clip under the front of a '41 Chev sedan. Given the size of that car, the clip didn't need narrowing, so they will fit under a pre '50 car. It was an excellent solution for upgading that car's front suspension. The key is to use a donor with the proper track for the recipient vehicle.

I've also had a '39 Chev, just 2 years older, and the unmodified Nova clip would have been a poor choice. In that one we had a stock Pinto/MII crossmember and suspension pieces. It worked fine. In fact, it rode every bit as nice as the '41 did, mainly because of the use of proper rate springs and shocks. There is absolutely no correlation between the ride of a V8 Mustang II and a rod equipped with the same suspension. (I don't have any experience with a stock MII's ride so I'll leave commentary on that to those more experienced). For one, the relationship of engine placement to axle (or spindle if you prefer) centerline is completely different in every rod application I've seen compared to the stock MII. I use the term rod as a qualifier to differentiate from the MII kits for later model Mustangs, Novas, etc. which seem to be popular now. And I've had a couple cars with Heidt's version of the MII, also fine riding cars.

I think there are several thousand rodders out there that would be mistified to hear that their MII front cars ride terribly. Yeah, I'm sure there are some that were/are done incorrectly and handle very poorly. But we've been putting the Pinto/MII systems under rods for nearly 30 YEARS now, and it doesn't appear that that system will fall out of favor any time soon. The marketplace is not that stupid to use something that's ineffective for that long. As an example, for some of you younger studs, there was a time in the late '60's, early '70's that guys tried to use Corvair front suspensions to upgrade to independent front ends. It seemed a logical choice because it was a narrow track, bolt in system. The problem was that the geometry wasn't well suited to the early cars, and it wasn't designed for a front engine arrangement. Some were made to work satisfactorily with quite a bit of massaging, but they didn't last long as the conversion of choice. Several reasons for that. One, there were too few systems available to meet market demand. But we've also run into that with the Pinto/MII stock set ups too. (Yeah, I know some of you inveterate junk hunters know where there are hundreds of them, but I'm talking about the general market here). But notice too, that no aftermarket companies sprang up with fully fabricated "replicas" of the Corvair geometry as they have for the MII. Why? Because the Corvair wasn't well suited for the job. And, no, this isn't a slam against the Corvair, it's just a point being made that not everything out there is as adaptable as certain examples.

As for the comment about replacement parts availability. Since the aftermarket guys have designed their geometry around the original Ford design, you could use Pinto/MII components on probably every one of them out there. The only thing that need be proprietary is the crossmember/hat assemblies. Of course, if you choose to use the suspension manufacturer's control arms, strut rods, spindles, etc. then you have limitations. But that goes back to how well you should choose the supplier. In other words beware of "fly-by-night" fabricators.

Now for brand preference. The original question was "which brand works best". I doubt there's a single answer to that question. There are a lot of good suppliers of MII type systems. If they follow Fords original geometry configuration, they should all work well. My experience has been there are more problems caused by improper installation, than by design limitations. And to that issue, I think there are some legitimate preferences based on how well the kit is fabricated for ease of PROPER installation. I'm going to attach a photo of a Heidt's front crossmember kit. And since I'm not smart enough to know how to get multiple pics in one reply box, I'll post a second with a pic of a Fatman's crossmember. I've often expressed my preference for Heidt's. This is primarily because I am a VALUE shopper before resorting to PRICE. I would rather have a product built UP to a high standard, than DOWN to a price point. Others may differ, and that's your choice. I don't particularly intend to be bad mouthing Fatman either, although I've heard quite a few do that. For me, it's strictly a matter of quality as I perceive it.

Look at the two pictures to see what I mean by the following comments. These two pictures are directly from each manufacturer's web site. I think the quality of the photos sets the tone. Notice the top mount for the shocks. The Heidt's has a nice, single piece, die stamped "cone". Not only do I think it looks nicer, but I think it's structural integrity is better than the comparative. The Fatman's looks like a "washer" welded to the end of a cut off piece of pipe. They may function equally, and with quality welding, the Fatman piece may hold up as well, but I think the appearance is indicative of an overall attention to detail. My bigger issue with the Fatman is the way it attaches to the frame. Again, since the Fatman is built down to a price point, he uses a piece of "C" channel at the ends of the lower member to attach to the bottom of the frame. With the Heidt's there is a triangulated "leg" at each end that fastens to two sides of the frame rail, rather than just the bottom, giving the structure a more rigid, torsional controlling configuration. The Heidt's will do a better job of limiting chassis flex in the front end induced by engine torque, and road surface irregularities. Similarly, the upper hats have a greater, more integrated structure for connection of the upper control arm, spring, and shock. Are there lots of Fatman setups out there that have happy owners? Sure! But for me, the relatively small extra cost for the Heidt's, the extra quality, and engineering, are worth it. Plus, even though it's most often out of sight, I prefer components that look better too.

The Fatman setup.