Thread: Roadster Stuff

Tweet

Originally Posted by Irelands child

Don,
NICE car

Since it appears that you have used the rumble area for the gas tank, why not put the battery there as well. With my '31, which has a trunk, I have decided that since there isn't enough room for a spare, I'll use one of Speedway's Optima holders - or you can get a fancy one from O'Brien Truckers. This only gives you the phone number - they don't have a web site yet http://www.obrientruckers.com/ . If you have a '32 frame, then you shold be able to put a drop out box somewhere - an 'A' frame - doubtful.

Somewhere I have a photo of the battery holder in the trunk taken before I stripped it out for paint but couldn't find it. The battery holder goes in the upper right corner, just above the rear end. The upholstery was actually before the final primer - and now I'm in deep do-do for paint because of temps here in upstate NY.

Gettin' cold there I'll bet.
Temps are dropping here in N/W Arizona, but not bad.
Days are still in the 70's here which is great garage - or exploring the dez - weather.

Nice battery holder.
What's the large access hole in the sheet metal for?

It looks like your trunk floor is a little flatter than is the trunk floor in my 31 Brookville body.
It has the 32 floor option and what looks like a little more drop down to the main floor at the front of the trunk floor than does yours.
Or . . . it's just an optical illusion, but I seem to remember you did change your trunk floor.

So far, my F150 seems to be doing ok in the front end dept.
The roads here in Sunny Arizona aren't too bad.
We travel a dirt road once in a while as well as about a hundred foot dirt run to get to the paved road, but other than that the F150 is living a life of ease just runnin' errands and the like.

Thanks for the extra pictures. I'm thinking! C9X previously convinced me to set up with the DeRalle trans pan so that part of my underside is similar, although I do not have my exhaust system yet and I appreciate the picture of the H-pipe and learning that the spacing is not critical if the main purpose is noise reduction. For Ireland's Child, I will rethink my battery location as to putting it in the rumble area as worth considering but the original idea was to keep gas and electricity separated by at least the rumble floor. I will look at some of the closed box types for the battery inside the rumble. Maybe the right side would be better as a sort of step down inside the rumble seat to put the weight on the right rear and to keep it away from the filler pipe on the left. The rear four bar mount on my Brookville A frame is centered under the frame rail and when I measured it would really limit the size and position of a future muffler, but maybe inside the rumble I will not give away much, still have it over the right rear and not be in the way of a muffler. Of course bullet mufflers would not take much space but I suspect they are really loud. By the way, has anyone tried stock Mustang mufflers? I really like the sound of the stock Mustangs. Well Ireland's Child I certainly understand your comment about winter temperatures. Although I did get a lot done this summer, I also wasted quite a few precious warm days. I am hoping for a 60 degree F day next week to try to do some fiberglass patches around the edge of the firewall on the inside. I think if I maintain the positioning with small bolts it will not matter if it takes three or more days to cure at the lower temperature and I will use a heat lamps for a few hours. Today I bolted in a plywood floor over the fiberglass floor to fill in the space between the iron plates along the inside of the body and cover the opening around the shift and brake handles. My local (heated) professional paint shop painted my new tilt column and the stainless plate for my firewall so my next pictures will hopefully show that the firewall plate blends in pretty well with the body color of the 'glass firewall. C9X, can we discuss how to mount a windshield wiper in the upper lip of the cowl instead of on the top of the windshield? Just thinking about it now I realize that a swing-out windshield will have to stay in place for a cowl mount so I guess that means the clamp on wiper is needed if the windshield can pivot out at the bottom.

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

Originally Posted by C9x

Gettin' cold there I'll bet.
Temps are dropping here in N/W Arizona, but not bad.
Days are still in the 70's here which is great garage - or exploring the dez - weather.

It's 29 degrees right now, with today's high expected to be ~45

Nice battery holder.
What's the large access hole in the sheet metal for?

I grafted a set of '32 frame horns to the TCI frame and am using a 15 gallon '32 style Tanks fuel tank. To easily access the the sending unit and pickup fitting felt that an access panel would work nicely. As a note, the Tanks 17 gallon tank was too low by 1.5", compromising ground clearance. Yogi's made an even exchange - a 15 for the 17 gallon tank

It looks like your trunk floor is a little flatter than is the trunk floor in my 31 Brookville body.
It has the 32 floor option and what looks like a little more drop down to the main floor at the front of the trunk floor than does yours.
Or . . . it's just an optical illusion, but I seem to remember you did change your trunk floor.

Brookville supposedly has as an option, a flat floor, so, being naive, said great, since I'm getting the trunk option, it will be flat from one end to the other - wrong !!! I sectioned the front of their trunk floor panel and made it flat. If I were to do it over, would make up an entire new floor and gain a bit more space plus strength - would have used 16 or 18 ga cold roll rather than their very soft draw quality 20-22 ga

If you have the standard flat B'ville floor, you have about a .75 +/- drop between the top of the body cross members to the embossed tin boards. What happened was that as I was kneeling in the body while installing my body bracing, they bent. I'm not a real heavy weight at ~190. So, off to the tin shop I went. They made me a set of double floor boards that fill the space to level with the body cross members. A swap meeted (invented word) the old f'boards for more than I paid for the new ones.
I added some square tubing for added support between the 2 pieces with tabs to bolt my Glide seats through then painted them up real well internally, then added some insulation from Juliano's (one of my LEAST favorite places for rod parts). These are now bolted in place rather than rivited. I hope this makes sense because I forgot to take in-process pictures

So far, my F150 seems to be doing ok in the front end dept.
The roads here in Sunny Arizona aren't too bad.
We travel a dirt road once in a while as well as about a hundred foot dirt run to get to the paved road, but other than that the F150 is living a life of ease just runnin' errands and the like.

.

I have my local dealer looking for a year or two old V10 F250. My 150 w/5.4 huffs and puffs too much pulling my 29 foot camper thru the Adirondacks - so far all he has found is junk.

Last night I searched the internet and a few catalogs for a battery box to put in the rumble seat area that would be sturdy enough to take a person stepping up on the step pads to the rumble seat and then down into the box as a step. There are a variety of boxes but it occurred to me that maybe the Optima Battery is "dry" and so not as much of a corrosion problem so a polyproplyene box should be adequate. However, what about hydrogen gas emissions in a closed place and maybe the need for a vent? I will already have a fuel tank vent which I intended to send out the right rear fender well so I wonder if I put the battery on the right side I will have two vents near each other. Is this a real problem or not? I would think if the Optima battery is dry there will be much less need for venting? If I use one of the cheap but nice $12 propylene boxes and add a piece of tubing for a vent that will be adequate? Actually the drip rail on my 'glass body is cut away on the bottom half so I do not think my rumble area is air-tight anyway and not water-tight either; I am counting on using all stainless bolts and fiberglass roll off to handle rain running down over the back surface to a few holes in the back edge of the body to drain rain water and I may enlarge those holes for better drainage. The back 8" of the Bebops floor slopes down so it forms a drain surface that is unusable anyway due to the positioning of the rumble lid when open or closed. Hence the need for venting should not be as serious as with a rubber-edged seal around a trunk. Thoughts about venting?

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

Originally Posted by Don Shillady

Last night I searched the internet and a few catalogs for a battery box to put in the rumble seat area that would be sturdy enough to take a person stepping up on the step pads to the rumble seat and then down into the box as a step.
Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

Don,
Take a look at the Summit p/n SUM-890102 for the 27 series batteries. I bought one before I was convinced that Optima batteries didn't need venting.

This is a quote from their FAQ's
"2. Does OPTIMA® ever gas?

When used with a properly regulated constant voltage charging system (such as an alternator) the OPTIMA will usually not emit hydrogen gas. However, gassing can occur when charging at higher voltage levels or in extreme high temperature conditions. In automotive applications this typically will not happen if the alternator/regulator stay below 15 volts. "

That Summit box is very heavily built, I just mic'ed it at .121 nom. thickness, and it has a vent system/hose along with a cover seal and 2 latches.

I would consider selling mine if you are interested - it is the big one but I was going to partition it to carry some common emergency hand tools (Never needed for a street rod !!).

Don,
I saw a '30A at the NSRA Burlington show that had a rubber seal around his body where the rumble flange fits. He said it was common ~.75+/- cross section closed cell weather stripping that he had installed several years previously - mind you, this was an original 2 owner car - his father bought new, he street rodded it. It's a nice car - nothing spectacular, but well thought out.

And yes, SS fasteners are great - just remember most of them are equivalent to a Gr 2 CS bolt - so no shear strength. I have hundreds of dollars of them in my project (and hundreds of left over incorrectly sized extras as well)

This is how I did mine. It is under the seat on the passenger side you can see the top of it in the photo's. My gas tank is vertical behind my seat and the rumble seat. It holds 16 gallons and I didn't loose any room. I hope this helps. That is my gas tank leaning agaist the wall on the left.

Wow! Ken maybe you should be building Indy cars! It is becoming clear to me that you really have to pack the stuff in there somehow. Ireland's Child, I will keep your offer in mind but I measured today and that battery box would take up about 40% of the foot space in my rumble area. I will muse over that but maybe just come up with some sort of a cover for the battery in its present rear position or maybe relocate it to where C9X has his near the right rear wheel. On Ken's neat setup I notice the four bars are inboard, mine are under the frame so I should have more space, but .... Today I got my stainless firewall plate back from the paint shop along with my new tilt column. I posted a picture of the firewall on the "Everybody building...." thread where DennyW lightened it up to show that it looks pretty good. Maybe if I had seen the underframe pictures of C9X and Ken's masterpiece I might not have started this project and I thought it would be simpler! The underseat circuitry in Ken's car is something for me to think about too, amazing work!

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

Don,
Thank you for the kind words. It took me 3 years to do this. I finally went for my first ride over Easter and just recently got enough bugs worked out where it is a fun car and dependable. It never broke down it always made it home but it had its own idiosyncrasy's. I think when you build a car you can't be afraid to change things, I have enough parts left over, from making changes, that I am building a 32 hyboy pickup. just my 2 cents.
Thanks again,
Ken

Originally Posted by Don Shillady

I will rethink my battery location as to putting it in the rumble area as worth considering but the original idea was to keep gas and electricity separated by at least the rumble floor. I will look at some of the closed box types for the battery inside the rumble. Maybe the right side would be better as a sort of step down inside the rumble seat to put the weight on the right rear and to keep it away from the filler pipe on the left.

I forgot I'd already posted that picture....

Far as the battery box goes, a lot of guys use the ol' plastic boat box with the nylon hold-down strap. They work ok, but imo there are better ways to do it. Main thing I don't like about the plastic boxes with the skimpy tie-down brackets is they could come loose in a wreck.

You could take a page from what some boat builders do. They make iceboxes from 3/4" plywood and glass it inside and out. Something along those lines would work well for a battery box and one good feature is they don't conduct electricity.
Hold the box down with some bolts through the floor. These bolts could double as the battery hold-down proper.

If you're going to run the box inside the trunk the battery needs to be covered so an errant piece of whatever (lawn chairs?) doesn't create a short circuit.


Of course bullet mufflers would not take much space but I suspect they are really loud.

If you get a long glasspack, say 28" or so - they run up to 36" in many brands - you'll get a nice tone. They're a little quiet for about two weeks, but after that they pick up the sound they're gonna have.


By the way, has anyone tried stock Mustang mufflers? I really like the sound of the stock Mustangs.

It may be difficult to duplicate the sound of the Mustang mufflers. My 88 Mustang GT w 5.0 liter had four catalytic converters. These add - or take away - from the sound characteristics as well. One muffler I had good luck with and liked was a Walker glass-packed Turbo-Muff. They're small like the two chamber FlowMasters and sound very nice. I ran a pair of these for a long while then went to the two chamber FlowMasters which are too loud even with an H-pipe. A lot of guys like noisy mufflers - and theyu're usually youngsters fwiw, but I like a very quiet car. If I could fit them I'd be running the very quiet Hemi-Muffs.
A really good muffler with a nice sorta like an old steel-pack sound is the FlowMaster three chamber mufflers. I have a pair of these on my 2002 F150 SuperCrew with 5.4 liter.
If a set of these would fit the 32 I'd run them instead of the two chambers.


C9X, can we discuss how to mount a windshield wiper in the upper lip of the cowl instead of on the top of the windshield? Just thinking about it now I realize that a swing-out windshield will have to stay in place for a cowl mount so I guess that means the clamp on wiper is needed if the windshield can pivot out at the bottom.
I had at one time the complete wiper setup from a 64 or so Falcon that I was going to adapt to the 32, but didn't. There are other stock wiper systems out there that adapt fairly easy. This question has been posed a few times on the HAMB and the people who reply have done the install.

You're right that a wiper mounted on the lower bar of a windshield frame limits swinging the windshield out.
It also limits how far back you can tilt the windshield posts.
In my case, the 32 was tilted to where I wanted and the RainGear wiper just fit.
There's wiring to consider and that limits horizontal travel of the wiper.

Keep in mind that any wiper system on a chopped roadster windshield is going to sweep a very small area.
Mine is useless in that respect (32 windshield is chopped 2" which is very common).
Rain-X does the trick here.
I recemmend it's use highly.
I've spent the day running the roadster along the SoCal coast in light-moderate rain and a few short trips in heavy rain.
The view through the windshield was not a problem.

One of the small Pacific RainGear wipers mounted on the windshield top bar may do the job for you.
What I didn't like about mounting it in that area was it limited the view.
Although, to be fair, the wipers I tried in that area were the longer body ones from Speedway.
If you sit down in the seat it shouldn't be a problem.

I've never felt the necessity to swing the windshield out for added ventilation.
Roadsters seem to be a rolling air leak anyway.

One thing I would recommend is a cowl vent.
These make a big difference as does the large swing up rear window in the cloth top.
Granted, the A's didn't come with a cowl vent - for obvious reasons - but if the cowl area is free it shouldn't be too hard to adapt a cowl vent to an A.

A louvered hood top tends to dump hot air down the cowl vent at lower speeds, but once on the highway airflow seems to change over the hood area and you get ambient air down the cowl instead of engine heated air.
One reason my 31's hood top is smooth.




Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I tried to post this yesterday, but it wouldn't go.


Very nice work Ken.
I especially like the where the driveshaft passes through the crossmember.
The bolts - I'm guessing with spacers - are a nice touch.

You're right on not being afraid to change things.
At any time.
Part of the fun for these little cars is the tinkering and tuning - engine and suspension.

Thanks C9X, I bought the pulls for the windshield but wondered the same thing, there are already plenty of air leaks. I did not know about Rain-X, I will look for it. I wonder if there are any alternative wipers to the Speedway topmounts? Maybe the longest bullet glass packs are the ticket for me. I was thinking about Thrush turbos but I would like to avoid the offset. It sounds like Mike/lt1s10 has a serious helath problem but I recall his comments that one could just get the cheapest $19 mufflers from Summit and try them for a while with the idea that that would let you run while you pondered over the options, but you can see Ken's setup is built for the long run with what look like stainless mufflers. The problem with stainless mufflers is that if you don't like their sound you have already paid a high price for the stainless. Then again I think there are stainless bullet types also. Yeah, I hear you about constant upgrade changes and Ireland's Child commented about left over stainless bolts; I already have quite a collection of left over bolts and extra parts. I guess that is sort of inevitable but my ultimate dream is to get the car running, thoroughly clean out the garage and set up shelves with spare parts!

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

Don,
If you go to www.tperformance.com it is Total Performance inc. in Ct. They have a wiper set up for the Dearborn Deuce that may work for you it is cowl mounted and comes with everything.
Just for your information my exhaust isn't stainless It is just coated. I don't like any stainless for exhaust either. you can't control the color changes it has after it is run.
I hope I am not over stepping my bounds, but it sounds like you are getting in a hurry. If I can offer you any help at all it is to not rush building you car. There will be a time when you are done and you sit back and look at it and say to yourself,"Damn, I wish I would of ....."
Respectfully,
Ken Thurm

I like to use muffler shop glasspacks since they usually have several different lengths in stock.

You have to weld an end on them and many times they're not as large on the inside as they ought to be, but for street use they work fine.

Many times glasspacks with, say 2 1/2" inlet & outlet can be 2" or so inside.

My experience with stainless bolts - series 308 & 316 - shows them to be about equal to a Grade 4 bolt.
Granted, there is no Grade 4 per se, but the tensile strength factor drops them in right between Grade 5's and hardware store Grade 3's.

Regardless of what their ratings are, I don't use them in critical applications.

You can get stainless bolts from ARP that exceed the strength rating of Grade 8.

And like always, watch it at the big box stores like Home Despair.
Their Grade 8's are made offshore and they don't equal a USA made Grade 8 . . . by a long way in some cases.

Regular stainless bolts, nuts and washers like I use are excellent on exhaust system.
Used on collectors and the like, they don't rust together like a steel or plated steel bolt will.

You want to be careful with that spare parts thing.

I had quite a few things left over from changing my mind to later tinkering etc. on the 32.
Then a friend of mine gave me a Camaro disc brake kit for solid axles and the 31 on 32 rails project was born.

Well just to keep the chatter going, I appreciate the various comments from C9X. I went through some roller coaster emotions over night. Last night I decided to go for it and sawed the hole in the firewall for the column. I experimented with some holes on thin plywood using a 2 1/2" hole saw and found it would only allow a 40 degree tilt for a 2" diameter column and then I scratched the new paint on my tilt column and went to bed bummed out over the whole scene but today after some rest I made the hole more oval vertically and found I can get the column in at a good angle if I use a 3 " drop and I will order one custom made by J&B Microfinish in IL at slight extra cost. I want the slanted mount a la '32 dash edge, swing feature and a cutout for the wires from the horn and turn signals and they can make one up in polished aluminum. The fear was that maybe I cut the hole too high up and might have to patch it closed and resaw a new hole with the obvious outcome that the patch would look bad. So to my relief the hole need not be changed and I took a suggestion from Bob Parmenter and sawed out another large plate of 1/4" aluminum for the inside of the firewall so I can attach the gas pedal without adding any more holes to the firewall. The plate will bolt to the back of the same bolts for the stainless plate on the front and the aluminum plate will support the steering column as well as the gas pedal. The reason for all of this is that I need a FLAT surface for the lower column mount instead of the rounding edge of the indent and I might as well have invisible screw mounts for the gas pedal. Fortunately, the scratches on the column paint are where the mount will be and will be hidden and probably more scratches will occur as I tighten the lower mount. Now I need to check out the Ace Hardware grommets for something that can be cut down for an oval hole 2 1/2" wide by 3" high OR try the trick of slitting some rubber tubing lengthwise. The only source I have for rubber molding is a selection in the Whitney catalog, soooooo does anyone here know of a source for rubber edge moldings?

Don Shillady
Retired Scientist/teen rodder

Don,
It sounds like you had a mild cardiac event when you opened the hole for the steering column - I think we've all been there ourselves - at least mine is steel and a mistake would have only been a bit of weldup with a patch - and I do have a major firewall repair/mod - Brookville supplied a 3" rather than the 5" recess that I ordered. As far as scratches, there is a low tack masking tape that wont leave residue (or at least much) that you can pick up at one of the big box stores.

If you want to keep firewall holes and bolts to a minimum, Lokar has an interesting gas pedal:http://lokar.com/ see page 47 in their .pdf catalog. They didn't have this one when I bought mine a couple of years ago.

Rubber products are available at Steele Rubber Products - their website catalog : http://166.82.96.9/homeframes.html
I really do not like these guys - act like they can't be bothered, but they do have a pretty extensive product line

And another that I just came across at Goodguys - Rhinebeck is Metro Moulded Parts - http://www.metrommp.com/
These guys were very helpful when I asked some off-the-wall questions and do appear to have even more than Steele.

I haven't bought anything from JC Whiney in many years - shipping is out of sight plus too much says Made in PRC (China).

Keep smilin' - it's a hobby