Thread: Roll Cage

Tweet

And just a note about having a cage---even if you aren't required to have one for your class, if you do have one, it must meet specs.

The first time this thing goes down the track they will probably black ball me.
I just want to get an idea what it's gonna do.
I've got a buddy that got a car that's 1100 pounds more than mine.
And we are running almost the same engine, My engine is built a little stronger.
He is turning high 9's in the 1/4 mile, the guy that did his cam was a guy name Steve Bowen he used to do all of special grinds for Lunati cams.
He ground me a couple roller cams identical to the one Bob Glidden won the world championship with while running a destroked 351 Cleveland.
My buddy made his first run with it, got to the end of the track and his front brakes
were smoking. Seems the line lock shorted out and the front brakes were locked up.
He still ran a low 10 in the 1/4. But it still a while off for me.
Oh and I am using what techinspector told me to use on the steel and thickness. Kurt

Well guys speaking of roll cages we just ordered our new one which will be here a week from today. YEA!!! been waiting a long time for this.. O its from pro tools. com

Originally Posted by stormstyles

Well guys speaking of roll cages we just ordered our new one which will be here a week from today. YEA!!! been waiting a long time for this.. O its from pro tools. com

I didnt know pro tools sells cages

LOL o s*** lol thats funny. Sorry I ment our new tubing bender. LOl I just got excited!!!!

"I just can't see a reason to use pipe...." Dave Severson

Availability? Florida is not exactly what you would call an "industrialized state". The biggest industry here is tourism. In the area where I live, I can get square or rectangular tubing, sheet steel, and flat stock from several places and have it delivered right to my door. If I want round tubing, however, I have to drive 50+ miles to the other side of Orlando (so I can pay for it in advance), order the tubing, wait until they call me (3 to 10 days!), and then go get the stuff myself. On top of that, I can't haul 20+ ft.long tubing with my truck (6 ft. bed) so I either pay them to cut it into more manageable lengths or I have to rent a truck to haul the stuff...

"And just a note about having a cage---even if you aren't required to have one for your class, if you do have one, it must meet specs." Jerry Clayton

Let me put your mind at ease; I have never built an entire roll cage from black iron (although I have seen it done). When I was racing stock cars, I would order a pre-bent cage kit from Speedway or Stock Car Products. I couldn't buy enough tubing to make a cage for what a kit cost. I have, however, used black iron to make bumpers, side nerfs, radiator hoops, and fuel cell cages. I have also used it to make extra bracing and door bars. My point in our previous discussion was simply that there is nothing metalurgically wrong with black iron.

Yes, I did bend the single hoop roll bar for my roadster from black iron. I had it on hand, I could bend it myself, I was at the point in the construction where I needed it done, and even black iron is better than what most T-buckets have (nothing). As for my frame, it is very nicely braced with appropriate bridgework from front to rear. Also, it is all new material; I didn't have to spend 40 - 50 hours repairing and boxing a 78 - 80 year old piece of fatigued and cracked steel before I could start building.

J Robinson; Your right there, no one had the tubing I needed either and I have to drive to the other side of Orlando to get the dom tubing I need for my A - Arms.
I do have a big trailer though, So I'll still have to flag some over hanging steel.
I had to go alot thicker then the required 0.118 because they don't carry it.
And I called 4 steel yards for it, so I'll end up with a 0.145 thickness on the tubing.
Kurt

TW Metals
10771 Palmbay Dr
Orlando, 32824
407=235=1400

Thank you Jerry. I'll check 'em out. They do not appear in my Yellow Pages here, so I would never have found them...

Thanks Techinspector for the help.
Just checked Summit Racing and they have the 2009 NHRA
Rule Book for $8.95
Kurt

Techinspector;
I’m not sure if this is a stupid question or not.
If it was originally a unibody car and you cut
the whole floor out to install a solid frame.
Would they still consider this a unibody
since it originally was?
So would you still have to use the 6 X 6 plates
in between the roll cage and the new frame?
If not, do I have to put anything in between
the frame and roll cage ends?
The sheet metal that was originally in it was
16 gage.
That’s what I was planning on putting back
in the car, { 16 Gage sheet metal }.
I’m still waiting on my book to arrive from
Summit on the rules.
Any other suggestions, that I may need to
know? Thanks Kurt

Treat it like any other framed car. Drop through the floor material and weld the bars to the frame or frame members.

Thanks Again Techinspector; I sure do appreciate all the help you've giving me.

Kurt

Ok Guys; I got some more questions for you.
The swing out side bar, What is a sher end?
Photo's would help me alot, to me this constuction is not very clear.
If any one could go in to some details on it, I would greatly appreciate it.
What is a clevis? I kind of know a slidding sleve is just not sure how to build it.
For the side bar it's self, I was thinking of using 1 5/8.
I need to be clear on thickness of all the pieces.
Also does the front of the swing bar have to be placed
right in the lower corner of the cage?
Like I said Photo's would help.
Also the two bars that come from behind to connect to the top of roll bar / hoop,
can those be bent to come through my back window strait or level with top of
the roll bar/hoop. Thanks Kurt

es

Originally Posted by vara4

Ok Guys; I got some more questions for you.
The swing out side bar, What is a sher end?
Photo's would help me alot, to me this constuction is not very clear.
If any one could go in to some details on it, I would greatly appreciate it.
What is a clevis? I kind of know a slidding sleve is just not sure how to build it.
For the side bar it's self, I was thinking of using 1 5/8.
I need to be clear on thickness of all the pieces.
Also does the front of the swing bar have to be placed
right in the lower corner of the cage?
Like I said Photo's would help.
Also the two bars that come from behind to connect to the top of roll bar / hoop,
can those be bent to come through my back window strait or level with top of
the roll bar/hoop. Thanks Kurt

es

Here's a sliding sleeve arrangement...
https://www.secureway1.com/alston/in...?productID=168
The rule reads:
"Sliding sleeves of 1 3/8 inch X 0.083 chromoly or 0.118 mild steel are permitted..."

Here's a swing out bar with clevises. The pieces shown with the half-moon cut in them weld to the bottom of the A bar and the middle of the B bar and are called male clevises. The female clevises are welded to the swing out bar shown in the photo.
https://www.secureway1.com/alston/in...?productID=169
The rule reads:
"Swing out side bar permitted on OEM full-bodied car 8.50 and slower. The following requirements (a through d) apply:
a. 1 5/8" OD x 0.083 chromoly or 0.118 mild steel minimum. Bolts/pins must be 3/8 inch diameter steel minimum and in double shear at both ends.
b. Male or female clevis(es) permitted. Male clevis must use minimum two 1/8 inch thick female brackets (chromoly or mild steel) welded to each roll cage upright. Female clevis must use minimum 1/4 inch thick male bracket, chromoly or mild steel welded to each roll cage upright. Pins/bolts must be within 8 inches of the vertical portion of both the A and B bars. A half-cup backing device must be welded to the B bar on the inboard side or the upper end of the swing-out bar on the outboard side, minimum 0.118 inch thickness chromoly or mild steel and must extend 1 5/8 inches past the center of the pin/bolt. A clevis assembly using a minimum 0.350 inch thick male component and two minimum 0.175 inch thick female components may use a 1/2 inch diameter grade 5 pin or bolt and does not require a half-cup backing device.
c. Sliding sleeves of 1 3/8 inch x 0.083 chromoly or 0.118 mild steel with minimum 2 inch engagement are permitted in lieu of the above pin/cup.
d. All bolt/pin holes in the swing out bar must have at least one-hole diameter of material around the outside of the hole.

Image 3 here shows a female clevis and male bracket. I can't tell in the photo if the male is minimum 0.350 inch and the females are minimum 0.175 inch, but if not, the connection needs a half-cup backing device.
http://www.bigdaddyperformance.com/i...s=0,1000000,13

All this gibberish about the half-cup device is to prevent the swing-out bar from breaking loose at the B bar and being pushed into the driver to cause injury.

The male clevis does not have to be right exactly in the connection of the A bar/floor. You can bring it up on the A-bar and inch or two. If the car's frame members are inboard of your legs and the floor has been modified, you'll need to include a sill bar that connects the bottom of the A bar to the bottom of the B bar, so it is better to move the swing out bar bracket up a little on the A bar to make room for the sill bar. You may not need a sill bar (also called a rocker bar) according to the rules, but you'll be glad it's there if you ever get up on the corner of the wall with the side of the car.

Although I disagree with the ruling, you are allowed to make one....ONE....bend in the C bars. Now, you don't have to take the C bars all the way to the trunk. The minimum angle from vertical is 30 degrees as viewed from the side of the car. So, figuring the B bar as zero, swing out away from the top of the B bar with your inclinometer and you'll see where the C bars could be run, probably to the front of the wheel wells that are in the driver's compartment. Cut through the sheet metal and attach to the frame at that point. No need to bend and go through the shelf panel if you don't have to. Also, you can move the C bars over on the B bar to the sides of the car if you want to, but don't go around the B bar curve at the roof any further than 5 inches below the top of the B bar. The bottom photo below shows a C bar installation that is attached too low on the B bar.