Thread: Octane Booster Fuel Additives - Opinions/Facts Needed!

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Originally Posted by 34_40

Showoff!

Hey, just one of the benefits of EFI!! I was just trying to reinforce that it should be easy and effective to back down the timing a notch or two, at least per the Edelbrock tech's...

One thing I've learned from this - I chased the story on ethanol octane rating based on Dave's statements about using E85. From what I read, pure ethanol has an octane rating of ~110, and Dave told us that E85 is ~106. The problem I have is that ethanol blends have a "shelf life" of around two weeks before they go into a phase seperation from absorbing water, and when that happens they lose four or five numbers on octane rating - if you buy 91octane that has 10% ethanol it starts absorbing water from the atmosphere immediately, and if you park for a few weeks or months you'll have 85 to 86 octane fuel, with water laden alcohol which may not be really good for your performance engine looking for 91 or better. Not a problem for your DD that gets refilled regularly, but for a car sitting all winter I'd worry about what's happening in the system. Not sure how this applies to E85 - maybe Dave can educate us?

Originally Posted by rspears

Hey, just one of the benefits of EFI!! I was just trying to reinforce that it should be easy and effective to back down the timing a notch or two, at least per the Edelbrock tech's...

One thing I've learned from this - I chased the story on ethanol octane rating based on Dave's statements about using E85. From what I read, pure ethanol has an octane rating of ~110, and Dave told us that E85 is ~106. The problem I have is that ethanol blends have a "shelf life" of around two weeks before they go into a phase seperation from absorbing water, and when that happens they lose four or five numbers on octane rating - if you buy 91octane that has 10% ethanol it starts absorbing water from the atmosphere immediately, and if you park for a few weeks or months you'll have 85 to 86 octane fuel, with water laden alcohol which may not be really good for your performance engine looking for 91 or better. Not a problem for your DD that gets refilled regularly, but for a car sitting all winter I'd worry about what's happening in the system. Not sure how this applies to E85 - maybe Dave can educate us?

And right you are Roger! I guess it is one of the perks of going electronic.. I've been curious also what may/will happen to our cars with the newer fuels. I've added stabilizer but am not sure if it's enough? Let's see what others think!?!?!

Originally Posted by Hot Rod Surfer

Thanks for all the replies, I guess that Roger and I must have posted at the same time cuz I just saw his reply.

That may be the deal though, I hadn't thought about it before. I guess that a couple of degrees might do the trick without losing too much HP or torque.

Lamin8r have you tried setting your timing back a mark or two?


Thanks all! I'll let you know how it works! But for the time being I'm heading back to my "snake oil" supplier and get another case

Yes,Eric..we did..still ran harder with the booster,,hauled some serious a$$,as you would expect with 451 inches of mad Mopar...and a fair bit of fruit stuffed inside it..

Hey, just wanted to let you know how things went with my snake oil!!!

I did get another case, but felt like I was sneaking power additives in the dead of the night!

So the next time I tuned it (needed it pretty badly too) I just retarded the timing a bit, cleaned up the carb, and reset the idle.

Yahooooo, now I'm running on 89 octane without a hint of a knock and just a little bit milder than before!!!

But when I was messing around (before the tune up) I came up with another question...

I used to use Chevron 93 octane, thought techron was the cats meow, and had to use octane adder to get rid of the detonation. But for other reasons, I changed over to Gate gas and was able to run their 93 octane without any knocks?? Tried the 89 octane and the knocks were back...before the tune up anyway.

So there must be a difference between Chevron and Gates fuel!

Anyone else notice any difference between any fuel? What is your favorite?

Inquiring minds have to know!

Don't know the Gates brand, but Techron is Chevron/Texaco's detergent additive. Great for keeping valve deposits down (big potential problem for port injected engines), but not intended to do anything for octane rating. Techron used to be the standard of the industry, probably still is, though the Shell detergent looks to be very effective as well.

Don't they also make sbc head gaskets in various thicknesses? I know they do for Olds engines because we were looking at them in Summits catalog.


Don

Originally Posted by Bob Parmenter

Shell detergent looks to be very effective as well.

Now I'm, again, disillusioned - that they have something else? Shell has been saying for the past couple of years that their big cleaner/upper is .... nitrogen !!! Both Kevin Harvick and Kurt Busch said so.

Originally Posted by IC2

Now I'm, again, disillusioned - that they have something else? Shell has been saying for the past couple of years that their big cleaner/upper is .... nitrogen !!! Both Kevin Harvick and Kurt Busch said so.

Yeah, my guess is they have a detergent that contains nitrogen molecules.......whoopie......but it makes for a marketing differentiation perhaps. Sorta like the old Pennzoil promotion of Z7 which was essentially the same/similar ZDDP anti-wear that any quality/qualified oil had, but they found a "clever" way to promote it. If you're interested in reading a bit more about detergents in gasoline look up "top tier detergent gasoline".

I like the BP and add MM oil, I remember Sunoco 260 wish they would bring that back to the pumps. The good old fun days.

Seeing as how this 'ol thread was about fuel, anyone tried, heard about, or ran the "oxygenated race gas". Couple guys said they were running it at the digs end of last summer, anybody have anything on it or was I just being told a tale?? Their story was they used much less per pass and it still had a 108 octane.....

Just read about this stuff when I was looking for E-85 around Vilano Beach I think they had a leaded one too, seemed a bit spendy for my needs but racing???Hmmmmm...vpracingfuels.com

VP100 (aka StreetBlaze 100)
Oxygenated with ethanol, this CARB-legal fuel is specifically engineered for high-performance street cars including sport compacts, muscle cars, street rods and more. It's environmentally friendly and street legal throughout the U.S. In applications with anything from 4- to 12-cyclinders or engines equipped with a turbocharger, supercharger or nitrous oxide system (NOS), VP100 will generate optimum power and performance. In turbocharged or supercharged applications, it allows an increase in boost without fear of detonation. NOS users can also leverage their higher octane ratings to step up to a more powerful nitrous oxide system. Dyno tests with a turbocharged application proved VP100 generates up to 14% more horsepower compared to premium grade 91 octane unleaded gasoline. Designed for use in cast-iron head engines with CRs up to 13:1 and aluminum head engines up to 14:1. Works well on the latest generation of electronically-controlled turbo engines. Contains no metal compounds and won't harm catalytic converters or oxygen sensors.

Yeah Eric, I read that deal on the VP site.... Doesn't really say what they're doing to it, got to be more then just dropping in a big shot of ethanol though, isn't it???? We've ran everything from 10% to 100% ethanol, blended it with everything from pump gas regular to VP race gas.... Trying to figure out what the heck they're adding that they give it the "oxygenated" name??

Where the heck are all our on site chemists, anyway???

Eric, what did you end up running in yours for the street?

Originally Posted by Dave Severson

.................got to be more then just dropping in a big shot of ethanol though, isn't it????

No, probably not. Without actual tech data can't say for sure, but ethanol is an oxygenate. So is NOS, and nitromethane, so was MTBE before being banned by EPA for fuel....................but the term oxygenate must resonate with some catagory or other of consumer. Could be a way of boosting or regaining sales lost to E85 to street driven muscle guys.

Thanks Uncle Bob--guess we should have been putting our "oxygenated" mixtures in a 55 gal. drum and selling them for ridiculous amount of money per gallon years ago, huh????

Originally Posted by Dave Severson

Eric, what did you end up running in yours for the street?

Now I'm down to 89 octane from my friendly Gate dealer, not so sure that I could use the Chevron 89 though...

Whatever, at least I'm not sneaking down to Oviedo to buy cases of snake oil

But after reading the vp racing stuff ("oxygenated with ethanol"?? isn't that what I get at the pump with up to 10% ethanol?)and noticing the difference between suppliers, it sounds like it is all snake oil!!!!