Thread: Bad Ast Astro Van Build

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Last nite I went to bed at 9:30. Woke up at 10:30 and my mind was running, working on the van. I never got back to sleep and was still awake when the alarm went off at 3:45. It was well worth it though as I figured out how I am going to drop the engine in the frame. It's still a bit of a tear up but it's super easy and all I have to make are a few 1/4" plates. Everything else will be reused after I cut the cross members out. I worked on the design all day today in UG and have dimensioned drawings. I am going to wait to do the job until I have the frame on the ground. I just need to verify ground clearance to the lowered cross members and trans pan but I think the plan will work.
I'll get some screen shots up loaded so you can see where I am taking it.
Mark

Loosing sleep over a project: THAT is focus!

Thanks! That's not what my wife calls it...
Here are some screen shots up so you can see where I am taking it.
http://images54.fotki.com/v1642/phot...m_00031-vi.jpg
http://images52.fotki.com/v1639/phot...m_00032-vi.jpg
The biggest change is the drop-out piece in the rear cross member. This will allow removal of the pan without having to yank the engine.
http://images54.fotki.com/v1642/phot...m_00033-vi.jpg
Mark

Good job figuring out the shortie plugs for your prop valve. I'd have just run in a long plug tight, maybe with some red locktite, and cut it off flush.

Cutting off the long plugs wasn't an option. The plugs are actually unfinished flare fittings.
http://images34.fotki.com/v1633/phot...MVC006F-vi.jpg
The drilled hole goes almost as deep as the head of the fitting. Cutting it off would have left an open hole...

I built a motor mount jig tonight. I used the solid motor mounts, bolted them in and then welded some tube and angle to maintain their position when unbolted.
http://images45.fotki.com/v1636/phot...MVC021S-vi.jpg
Now I can cut them out and gut the cross member and not worry about getting them back where they belong.
http://images12.fotki.com/v1641/phot...MVC013S-vi.jpg
I tacked pieces of angle onto the frame to locate a piece of 2 x 4 tubing set on the top rails.
http://images52.fotki.com/v1639/phot...MVC012S-vi.jpg
Another piece of angle is welded to both ends of the 2 x 4 to locate it side to side
http://images61.fotki.com/v1635/phot...MVC011S-vi.jpg
I then tacked some more angle to the 2 x 4 to locate the jig side to side.
http://images45.fotki.com/v1636/phot...MVC020S-vi.jpg
Now, once the mounts are cut out and trimmed I can drop them straight down 3 inches and rebuild the attachments to the frame.
http://images41.fotki.com/v1634/phot...Smarkup-vi.jpg
If I can delete that cross member I will be happy. What do you think? With all of the bracing going back to the upper rail I don't think all of that structure is necessary. The engine itself with act as a stressed member so can I get rid of that cross member and get some ground clearance back?
Mark

The engine itself generates tortion stress. I wouldn't rely upon it to add structure: that is the frame's job.

True. If I keep the cross member I think I will reduce the size from the 2" DOM down to 1". That will still gain me some clearance and keep the rails from spreading.
Mark

Well, I did some serious thinking, looking back through all of my build pics and came to the conclusion the engine is staying where it is. Too many other issues when I start lowering it more. Alternator, oil pan clearance, trans mount, etc. I am leaving it where it sits and I will deal with the air cleaner/dog house issue when I get to it.
I've been working on the brake line routing. Like the rear suspension I mocked up both of the front suspensions so I could bolt up the soft lines I got from Tobin at Kore3.
Everything looks pretty good, I have the spots for the weld-on tabs marked out and am looking at steering stops, stab bar attachments and a few other issues that need to be rectified before the chassis is painted.
Here are a few pics from the last few nights.
One tab needs a cut out to fit on the rear crossmember.
http://images54.fotki.com/v1642/phot...MVC016S-vi.jpg
Cut out with the bandsaw and cleaned up with the grinder, fits like a glove...
http://images59.fotki.com/v1640/phot...MVC017S-vi.jpg
This is where the tab will go. On the drivers side right above the shock mount.
http://images12.fotki.com/v1641/phot...VC022S2-vi.jpg
I hung the front suspensions & brake corners.
http://images52.fotki.com/v1639/phot...VC019S2-vi.jpg
http://images54.fotki.com/v1642/phot...VC016S2-vi.jpg
With the lines bolted to the calipers I could move the corner through left and right steer to see where the lines wanted to fall naturally. This is important to avoid twisting the lines during steer. Twisting will weaken the lines AND MAY loosen fittings over time. Not a good thing.
With no steer, going straight, the hose is relaxed and in a good spot to stay out of the coil-over AND the wheel as it is spinning rapidly next to it. (I hope)...
http://images34.fotki.com/v1633/phot...MVC018S-vi.jpg
RH corner at right lock. The hose curls up in a linear arch with no twist.
http://images61.fotki.com/v1635/phot...MVC019S-vi.jpg
At full left lock the hose still has some length so it is not pulling against either fitting.
http://images52.fotki.com/v1639/phot...MVC021S-vi.jpg
The LH side line is pretty much a mirror image of the right side. I thought it would be but I still had to mock it up to verify my "think so".
http://images46.fotki.com/v1637/phot...VC017S2-vi.jpg

Next step will be mounting the rack and developing the steering stops. Is there a rule of thumb for how much to leave at the end of rack travel? I was thinking about a 1/4" or so. Anybody?
Well, that's where I'm at with it. Lots to do to get this thing wrapped up and paint ready.
Mark

I got a bit done tonight. Worked on the steering stops. I bolted in the rack and got the steering "wheel" centered (it's a pair of vise grips...). Full lock to lock on the Corvette rack is 2.63 turns, just shy of 2 3/4's. Turning the wheel to full lock and then backing out of that by about 1/4" of travel (on the knuckle) should get me a good starting point for setting up the stop bolts.
I took some pics but it's kind of hard to see. I used a magnet to set the bolt where I want to hit the LCA and measured for a piece of 3/8th's plate I will use to fab the bolt tab.
This is the right lock stop bolt on the passenger side.
http://images59.fotki.com/v1640/phot...MVC006S-vi.jpg
This is the right lock bolt on the drivers side.
http://images45.fotki.com/v1636/phot...MVC009S-vi.jpg
Using these positions I came up with 4 stop tabs that just happen to all be the same size. 1" wide by 1 1/2" long. I laid them out on a scrap piece of 3/8th's and chunked them out with the bandsaw.
http://images59.fotki.com/v1640/phot...MVC017S-vi.jpg
I laid out the hole in each one and drilled and tapped for a 3/8-16. The tap I used is out of the original Craftsman tap and die set I bought with graduation money in 1974... It has cut a LOT of threads and I have never broken any of the taps.
http://images41.fotki.com/v1634/phot...MVC028S-vi.jpg
I'll round these over a bit before I weld them to the knuckles. I will also flatten that edge on the control arm to give a better target for the bolt head.
http://images54.fotki.com/v1642/phot...MVC022S-vi.jpg
I got SOMETHING done tonight.
Mark

Picked up a junction block for the front brake lines. It will split the line from the prop valve out to the left and right front calipers.
It will sit on the driver side inner frame rail.
http://images54.fotki.com/v1642/phot...MVC005S-vi.jpg
I grabbed a chunk of NiCop (my last bug piece) and started looking at getting it routed from the junction block to the passenger side rail.
The best route was running back a bit to the last crossmember that runs right under the front of the engine. After getting a few bends done it started looking pretty good.
http://images12.fotki.com/v1641/phot...MVC002S-vi.jpg
Dinking it around all of that tubing took some time but I got it ran and I didn't destroy it in the process.
http://images52.fotki.com/v1639/phot...MVC009S-vi.jpg
This is the passenger side. It runs forward a bit once it gets back to the rail and will drop down under the rail to reach the weld-on brake tab. I won't finish this end until the tab is installed.
http://images51.fotki.com/v1638/phot...MVC003S-vi.jpg
The line is still loose, I haven't added the clips yet. I will center it and tweak the fit as I install the clips.
http://images59.fotki.com/v1640/phot...MVC012S-vi.jpg
I also got the line built from the junction to the left front tab. This was a no brainer as it was only about 4" long with one bend.
I took some quick measurements and did a layout so I could get the bend and the lengths out to the tab correct.
http://images59.fotki.com/v1640/phot...MVC014S-vi.jpg
Once I had that figured out I put a flare on each end and a bend in the middle. Done!
http://images59.fotki.com/v1640/phot...MVC022S-vi.jpg
Fits like a glove!
http://images54.fotki.com/v1642/phot...MVC026S-vi.jpg
Thanks for watching!
Mark

Didn't get a lot of time out in the shop Sunday but it was enough to get the clips mounted for the Right Front hardline.
I started in the middle of the crossmember. Once this was tightened up I could center the line and determine where to put the end clips.
http://images52.fotki.com/v1639/phot...MVC001S-vi.jpg
I mounted the outer clips so they captured the tangent of the bend radius on each end. This keeps the line from itching around between the clips.
http://images45.fotki.com/v1636/phot...MVC014S-vi.jpg
This is the driver side bolted up.
http://images12.fotki.com/v1641/phot...MVC016S-vi.jpg
And the passenger side. I'll finish routing this end after the brake tabs are welded on.
http://images12.fotki.com/v1641/phot...MVC015S-vi.jpg

Mark

I was working on another project during the week so I didn't get much done on the van until Saturday morning. I rolled the tubing bender out and got the rear anti-roll bar bent up.
I made a drawing of the bar in CAD with dimensions so laying it out took no guess work. The 4.71 dimension is the arc length of the "centerline" of the bend. This is the length of tubing used to make the 90deg bend between the tangents.
http://images54.fotki.com/v1642/phot...MVC009S-vi.jpg
Using the roller jig to mark the tubing. I laid out the tangent lines just like the drawing said. Rolling the tubing in the jig gives me a perfectly straight line, all around the tubing, at each tangent point. makes setting it up in the bender easy.
http://images59.fotki.com/v1640/phot...MVC010S-vi.jpg
http://images45.fotki.com/v1636/phot...MVC012S-vi.jpg
Here you can see the two tangent points laid out for one bend.
http://images54.fotki.com/v1642/phot...MVC007S-vi.jpg
Getting the bender set up. Having it on the cart AND automated, sure does make this less of a chore. The rear bar is 1" O.D. x .095 wall 4130. it bends pretty easy anyway but this makes fun.
http://images54.fotki.com/v1642/phot...jpg?1486245473
Set up for the 1st bend and about a 1/2 of the way through it.
http://images16.fotki.com/v382/photo...jpg?1486245478
Out to 90 degrees. I am sneaking up on 90 here. To get "90" the tubing needs to be over bent so that, when it springs back, it stays at 90. I over bend it a bit, stop, loosen the jack screw to let the machine relax, measure the bend then bend a bit more if needed. I did this twice for the first bend and once for the second. Knowing what it takes helps with the second bend.
http://images46.fotki.com/v1637/phot...MVC015S-vi.jpg
getting the second bend done.
http://images59.fotki.com/v1640/phot...jpg?1486245479
Part of doing this correctly is making sure the second bend is on the same plane as the 1st bend. Having one leg point up and the other pointing down is not a good thing.
This is the bar after bending. Setting it on the floor tells me if I got it right or not. No rocking in either direction means I got it right.
http://images46.fotki.com/v1637/phot...MVC017S-vi.jpg
In this pic you can see the tangent points and where they fell in the bend.
http://images46.fotki.com/v1637/phot...MVC018S-vi.jpg
All trimmed up and ready for the endlink tabs to be welded on. I won't do that until I get the rest of the system mocked into place so I can tack everything at one time.
http://images54.fotki.com/v1642/phot...MVC020S-vi.jpg
This is how the bar looked in my CAD model.
http://images45.fotki.com/v1636/phot...ARREAR1-vi.jpg
Thanks for following.
Mark

Thanks for all the great pics and the detailed updates.
I'm not sure if I've ever said this to you, but... you do some great work!

Yep, exactly what the man above said as I enjoy looking and following along too.