Thread: Rack-Pinion or Manual steering Box

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Heck, just bring it over next week Skids... Got to put the rack and build new suspension for the front of my 'maro... Might as well put 'em side by side and gang up on the projects!!!!!

Also, pay attention when you pick out a rack, there are a couple different steeing ratios offered.....

I think the chrysler Omni was rear steer---

A word ob caution on rack steering conversions---beware of bump steer--they need to be mounted at the correct height andpivot points

Originally Posted by skids72

Thanks guys... yes I think I'll need new spindles for front steer or if it's just matter of different arms for the spindles I got.... crossmember is a deal killer for rear steer... running drums all around now and was planning to go disc as part of this project... I'll see if father time and mother pocketbook have it in the cards this winter..

-Chris

i thinking you did not read my post no you just swap your arm left to right and put them in the front or use gto arms like i said your spindles are the same as rear steer A body GM . i do know abit about this i did both my gto from drum to disc and then back to drum spindles for the wilwood brake kits and sold the disc spindles to a guy to use on his 68 camaro

The rear steer arm is not the same arm as the front steer arm for these spindles. The front steer arms put the outer tie rod outboard of the lower ball joint; while the rear steer tie rod placement is inboard. If you use rack & pinion with the stock a-frame location, bump steer will be really bad. You may get by with the bad bump steer for straight line racing, but this could get you in trouble if something goes wrong during a pass and you have to make a hard steering correction. Beware!

Originally Posted by deuce4papa

The rear steer arm is not the same arm as the front steer arm for these spindles. The front steer arms put the outer tie rod outboard of the lower ball joint; while the rear steer tie rod placement is inboard. If you use rack & pinion with the stock a-frame location, bump steer will be really bad. You may get by with the bad bump steer for straight line racing, but this could get you in trouble if something goes wrong during a pass and you have to make a hard steering correction. Beware!

never said they were the same arms i did not say they will work said they could. you need to work thru and see if it would. if you say it will not OK yes you would have to check for bump steer the front steer arms could work ? bump steer.. you will have a chanch of bump steer if you put the rack in worng to ???? i drop the center link down 1 inch on the gto i do not have bump steer that is why i just re work what i had was worried about THE BUMP STEER never have seen him

Originally Posted by pat mccarthy

i thinking you did not read my post no you just swap your arm left to right and put them in the front or use gto arms like i said your spindles are the same as rear steer A body GM . i do know abit about this i did both my gto from drum to disc and then back to drum spindles for the wilwood brake kits and sold the disc spindles to a guy to use on his 68 camaro

I read your post I guess I misunderstood... you're saying just swap the arms and I'm good to go? And I can use the same spindles with discs? You'll have to forgive my ignorance, I really know NOTHING about this stuff... Is there a junkyard rack I can throw in without a ton of fabrication... then there's the whole steering linkage and column and all that I'll need to figure out... I need to do a lot more research.

Thanks again,

-Chris

P.S. Okay I posted prematurely again... just read the last couple posts. I guess there is more to it than I thought... any good reference books on this or a "kit" that will keep me out of trouble?

Originally Posted by skids72

I read your post I guess I misunderstood... you're saying just swap the arms and I'm good to go? And I can use the same spindles with discs? You'll have to forgive my ignorance, I really know NOTHING about this stuff... Is there a junkyard rack I can throw in without a ton of fabrication... then there's the whole steering linkage and column and all that I'll need to figure out... I need to do a lot more research.

Thanks again,

-Chris

P.S. Okay I posted prematurely again... just read the last couple posts. I guess there is more to it than I thought... any good reference books on this or a "kit" that will keep me out of trouble?

if you buy a wilwood kit they need to be drum spindles if you use a gm disc brakes you need the spindles to be for GM disc spindles drums spidles just will not do the job for swaping the arms to the front decuce4papa said you can not do it .maybe you could use A body arms for front steer i just do not know ?

Chris. "Chassis Engineering" by Adams will help you understand the issues you will have with rack and pinion install. All well engineered suspensions will have "bump steer". The turning radius of the inside tire will be less than the outside tire and front end design must have a way of accounting for this on a properly engineered suspension. The steering arm is only a small piece in the puzzle here. You will need to have a good understanding of the engineering involved to make a good rack and pinion install. As Pat mentioned, even the rack & pinion placement up and down as well as front to back changes the amount of bump steer. Lots of variables here.

Thanks d4p... I'll check it out!

-Chris

Hay skid's hope you find what your looking for,and I assume you'v already looked at The NHRA rule book to make sure your good to go with this change.As for me at this point I think A S-10 manual steering box fit's my budget and needs hope every thing works out for you,don't no what class's you run ?.Thanx to every one for your input good info

Originally Posted by deuce4papa

Chris. "Chassis Engineering" by Adams will help you understand the issues you will have with rack and pinion install. All well engineered suspensions will have "bump steer". The turning radius of the inside tire will be less than the outside tire and front end design must have a way of accounting for this on a properly engineered suspension. The steering arm is only a small piece in the puzzle here. You will need to have a good understanding of the engineering involved to make a good rack and pinion install. As Pat mentioned, even the rack & pinion placement up and down as well as front to back changes the amount of bump steer. Lots of variables here.

your taking about one wheel turning in faster in then the other in a turn thats ackerman steering and thats a big deal .some bump steer can be work out with spacer on the arm s and drilling out the tapper and using a rod end and not a tie rod end.i was looking to do this if needed on the goat it just did not need to be done

Originally Posted by deuce4papa

Chris. "Chassis Engineering" by Adams will help you understand the issues you will have with rack and pinion install. All well engineered suspensions will have "bump steer". The turning radius of the inside tire will be less than the outside tire and front end design must have a way of accounting for this on a properly engineered suspension. The steering arm is only a small piece in the puzzle here. You will need to have a good understanding of the engineering involved to make a good rack and pinion install. As Pat mentioned, even the rack & pinion placement up and down as well as front to back changes the amount of bump steer. Lots of variables here.

your taking about one wheel turning in faster in then the other in a turn thats ackerman steering and thats a big deal .some bump steer can be work out with spacer on the arm s and drilling out the tapper and using a rod end and not a tie rod end

Yes. Ackerman and bump steer are both big deals and are created through the design of the suspension. Both create toe. If Chris will purchase and read the book, everything that has been mentioned in this post will be explained in detail. Great reading Chris. You will enjoy it.

a older book called how to make your car handle is good to