Thread: 4 Speed 101 ????

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OK guys I have decided that I am done with Automatics at least for a while. My newest 46 Ford tudor is one fine driving car. just got it a couple of weeks ago and even with this lousy rainy weather here in Alabama I have put a 1,000 miles on this car. It came with a SBC and the usual Turbo 350 and that for this driver is boring. So I am on that quest to put a Muncie 4 speed in it. Trouble is that danged linkage thing, so I have decided to go with a Hydraulic clutch set-up and a Muncie. Trouble is it has been about a zillion years sense I messed with this stuff and I am lost with nowhere to start.

There is a poster on here, who is supposed to really know his way around the Hydraulic's, I won't mention any names, and I have sent him half a dozen e-mails and a couple of PM's with no luck and no response. So I am turning to you guys.

Think I have a pretty good idea of the parts I need, but the specifics allude me. Here's the list:

Bellhousing ---------- But which one will the 621 casting # work here?
Clutch & Pressure Plate---- Once again which one and what size?
Throw out bearing
Pilot Bushing ---- Do I need a special one for the Muncie?
Slave Cylinder ---- Don't even have a clue here.
Mouinting bracket for the slave cylinder
Master cylinder for the slave
Pedal assemble --- Any advice

Any help will be gratefully recieved.

Roland

I use hydraulic clutch and slave, usually a Wilwood setupo and -4AN line and fittings. Don't know poop about chebbie bellhousings, I'm a Ford guy but there was a zillion chebbies came out with Muncies. Personally I spend a few more bucks and always use a scattershield. Far as I know, all the chebbie pilot bushings are the same. Clutch depends on how hard you're going to beat on it and what flywheel you want to use... I use McCleod clutches and flywheels for the street and for racing.......

PS--If you don't already have a 4 speed, might want to consider a 5 speed, either a T-56 or one of the TKO's, then the shifter is a rail shifter and has multiple positions options and is on top of the trans.....

This place should have a Kit for you Car . And in the Long run may be cheaper and easier to do http://www.classicchevy5speed.com/?g...FRYLIgodzAQjkw

i did some race set ups you need to know what pressure plate set up you want for throw out set up there many the best thing would be is to buy the setup from one source they will sell you evey thing then make it work from there a stock pilot are the same use the shock bronze oillite type on the fly wheel you will need to know what year if a one pc or two pc rear main seal engine for a pedals assembly out of a ford truck or chevy s 10 so you have the jar for your slave or look at the wilwood set ups

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Some years of Chevy pickups had hydralic clutches back in the 60s and there was even one with the slave on the passenger side if you could find bellhousing from one of them.
Good choice btw. I am a 3 pedal man all the way. Stickshift cars have so much more personality.

Willowbilly3 is right about them Hyd Clutch Set up-s in the Older GMC Truck's . Most of are Med GMC Trucks at my work have them 1972-89 292 Str-6 and 4.3 V6 . The Bellhousing Looks Like the Old 1955-57 Checy Cast Iron one's . But it has two Threaded 5/16" Thread Bosses on the Right side with the 292 and the Left Side with the 4.3 . Ether Bellhousing would work on a SB . But they are Large and Heavy . The Clutch set up is a 12" Like a 1 Ton Truck Stock they had the three finger set-up and the 168 teeth Flywheel . The Clutch Master is just a Small two Bolt Mounting to the Firewall . Not a Bad why to add a 4-Speed ?

Thanks guys, I have been checking for bell housings and have seen a few of the truck's with the clutch fork and slave on the passenger side. Anyone have an idea on how big that hole is in the center of the bell? I can not seem to find any data on this spec.

looks like I have purchased two transmissions ( UuuP's) One is a T-10 Borg Warner looks like a close ratio 4 speed for the early chevys up to about 1965. The other is a Muncie M-20 out of a 1967 Chevelle.

It appears that the only problem, if there is one, is to be sure the center hole in the bell Housing will accept the tranny's input shaft retainer. Trouble is after spending hours looking on this computer I can't find out these deminsions. Here are a couple of pictures of the input shaft retainer on both trannys anyone know this spec? If not thats cool I will have the trannys next week or so and can measure them then, but I would like to aquire all of the parts I can first. First pic is the Muncie so the second must be the BW T-10, and these are pics of the actual transmissions i purchased.

It does appear that the GM bellhousing with the casting # that ends in "621" is big enough for either of these transmissions. And I think that bell housing will accept either an 11" or a 10 1/2" clutch. If I am wrong in this information please clue me in.

Thanks Guys-- Roland

Ok here are some Photos of the Transmissions that we use in them GMC Trucks with that Cast iron Slave Cylinder Bellhousing . They are #sm-465 Muncie's and 435 N.P both 4-Speed 10 Spline Inputs . The Front Bearing Retainer Looks the Same Size as the GM Car Muncie's . I would Have to Measure one to tell you . I could do that and give you other Part #s Monday when I return to work . I rebuilt these Transmissions when we where Slow .

Thanks guys for the advice, I have solved these problems.

Dave, I hear you about the T56 or TKO 5 speeds, but I really want this 46 to be somewthing of a nostalgia kind of thing. If I go waaaaaay back and remember my first stick car that I actually owned. It was right after I returned from Nam it was a used 1964 GTO with a 4 speed. I managed to complettly destroy the motor in that old goat in about 6 weeks just racing from one red light to the next. San Diego was never the same again. It was a four speed car and I remember like it was yesterday that 4 speed.

I was able to get all of the parts I needed for this changeover from ONE guy and even made a new friend in the process. Mike Forte a poster here was helpful and steered me through the mine field. While I have bought two transmissions already a Muncie M20 and a Borg Warner T 10 Mike even had another T 10 at such a good price I bought it as well, so now I am 4 speed poor. but thats cool i also got another car and have decided to go 4 speed in it as well.

Anyone needed transmission stuff or really anything to do with Hot Rods give this guy a chance, good prices and he drives what he builds. And Dave he is a Big Ford Motorsport dealer, his got an all aluminum FE427 engine in his shop that may be hard to pass up, pricy but it sure sounds interesting.

Fortes Parts Connection
http://www.fortesparts.com/index.cfm

Heres a shot of his bellHousing and slave cylinder set-up.